tv CNN Newsroom Live CNN February 22, 2016 10:00pm-1:01am PST
>> reporter: riding high into nevada, donald trump is holding the best hand in the battle for the gop nomination. his two main rivals, marco rubio and ted cruz are busy attacking each other. >> every single day, something comes out of the cruz campaign that's deceptive and untrue. >> reporter: rubio began the day demanding cruz fire someone over the video that accused the republican of dismissing the bible. actually rubio says all of the answers in it. a blatant fabrication. rick tyler who circulated the video apologized. rubio snapped, that's not good enough. >> at some point there has to be a level of accountability or you're sending the message to people that work for you, go out and do anything you want and if you get caught, we'll just
apologize but keep doing it. >> reporter: cruz announced he's asked tyler to step down. >> and this morning i asked for rick tyler's resignation. i had made clear in this campaign that we will conduct this campaign with the highest standards of integrity. >> reporter: the bogus attack is the latest raising questions about how cruz has conducted his campaign. trump seized on the flap tweeting more dirty tricks. trump is also getting help in the form of an unforced error from john kasich whose awkward remark about the women backing his first state senate campaign in the late 1970s annoyed one supporter. >> we've got an army of people and many women who left their kitchens to go out and go door to door and put yard signs up for me. >> first off, i want to say your comment about the women came out of the kitchen to support you. i'll come to support you but i won't be coming out of the kitchen. >> i got you. >> kasich later explained it was
an off the cuff mark. >> i'm real and maybe sometimes i might say something that isn't artfully said the way it should. >> reporter: trump is poised to wrap up another big victory in nevada. he's boasted his support comes in all shapes and sizes. >> so we won with everything. we won with highly educated, pretty well educated and poorly educated. but we won with everything. tall people, short people, fat people, skinny people. just won. >> reporter: but rubio who spent part of his childhood in nevada and his supporters are getting aggressive. a pro-rubio superpac started airing this attack ad pounding trump and cruz. >> trump erratic, unreliable. cruz, calculated, underhanded. >> reporter: and rubio is attracting more establishment support picking up new gop endorsements. >> this is a three-way race. at the moment it's between rubio, cruz and trump. there's some others in the race but i don't think they'll be in
the race that much longer. >> some want kasich to drop out and funnel his support to rubio. >> it's funny. i think it's ridiculous. >> what's the fallout of cruz firing rick tyler? >> i think it's pretty damaging to a campaign to have a communications director step down over a dirty trick. as one campaign veteran once told me, you never want the staff to be the story. that's what happened here. in addition to being untrue, it was plain dumb. no one questions marco rubio's faith. now you have marco rubio and donald trump slamming cruz as dishonest. a rubio spokesperson sent us a statement saying there's a culture in the cruz campaign from top to bottom that no lie is too big. trump has been hammering this theme for weeks. tonight he can come out to this crowd in las vegas and say, i told you so. this was a tough day for ted cruz. tough day for john kasich.
and the beneficiary primarily was donald trump. >> jim acosta, thanks. more on the cruz shake-up. top opponents and surrogates have been speaking out. listen to what a rubio supporter said in the situation room. >> rick tyler wasn't the problem, isn't the problem. this thing has gone on for some time. i was there in iowa on the ground when the rumors started flying that ben carson was going to drop out and people should consolidate with cruz. i was astonished. i asked people, where is this coming from? they said it was coming from the cruz campaign. it started then and then there was this apology that came out. then the photo shopped picture of marco rubio shaking hands with president obama with their left hands and heads placed on the wrong thing. this is a cultural problem within this campaign.
>> joining us is cruz supporter and former virginia attorney general ken cuccinelli. a rough day for senator cruz having to get his communication director's resignation, although he just called him a staffer. is this a more systemic problem inside the campaign? >> no, we've run a campaign to the highest integrity from the beginning. when something like this happens, the senator act with decisive action. asked rick to resign. and, in fact, rick did resign. we're never going to be a campaign that questions the faith of other candidates. that's not going to happen. and senator cruz made that exceptionally clear in the clearest way he could by asking for the resignation of the communications director. we're trying to turn become to the things that matter to americans' lives like getting a flat tax to wipe out the special interest groups benefits and to improve our economy. and to address the concerns that people in nevada and the super tuesday states are talking about. and that's, how do we get our economy going and ted's plan to do that as well as fighting isis at the border and --
>> so you don't think voters care if a candidate is doing dirty tricks or photo shopping a candidate's has on someone else's body and putting out flyers or spreading rumors? >> i think what republican voters care most about is finding a candidate who has got a track record of fighting against washington, going down to the senate floor, telling the truth about what's going on, even among republican senators. >> so how do you explain -- >> including our leadership, when they are wrong. pardon me? >> how do you explain the photo shopped flyer? >> you know, that's just graphics. it's making a visual point. it's not a substantive point. substance is what's your plan to get the economy going again? what is your record of voting and leading in washington to defeat the establishment. >> so if a news organization put a picture -- >> -- in the history of the world has gone to iowa and told the good people of iowa that big corn and ethanol has to go.
>> if a news organization superimposed your head on somebody else's body shaking president obama's hand you'd have no problem with that as long as you thought people knew it was some sort of dramatic representation? >> my first concern is always -- my first concern is always going to be, is what they are saying there correct or not. and the substance of what we've been saying is absolutely correct. >> interesting. so if cruz's rivals, especially trump and rubio, have obviously been trying to paint your candidate as untrustworthy. trump tweeted, wow, ted cruz falsely suggested that's marco rubio mocked the bible. more dirty tricks. obviously it wasn't cruz himself saying this. it was rick tyler in a tweet. are you concerned the trust question, though, could hurt him tomorrow and beyond? >> well, trust is always a big deal.
americans don't trust anything in politics. they don't trust you all in the media. they don't trust people in washington. and you need to overcome that, you need a track record. ted's track record goes back to when he was a teenager memorizing the constitution and making his way around texas teaching people about it through being the solicitor general, winning awards as the texas solicitor general that democrats supported him for what a good job he did defending the constitution. and then moving on to the senate and continuing that as the only consistent conservative in this race. >> if your candidate doesn't win texas, is that it for him? >> obviously, a home state is absolutely critical. we're not going to make any bones about that. you have to win your home state. really to have a viable path forward. and right now, with ted's popularity in texas, we see him heading to -- cruzing, in his case, to a victory.
we expect to do well on super tuesday. he's invested more time than any other candidate in the super tuesday states. we have more cash on hand than all the other campaigns combined. so we're prepared for that next week's worth of battles in all of these states as the race goes from one state at a time to national. >> ken cuccinelli, appreciate it. we'll be covering it all from las vegas. joining us is adam chan and kevin mattingly and gloria borger. the shake-up of the cruz campaign, rick tyler. we've had him on this program a lot. on the heels of the photo shopped picture and these other things, how do you see it playing out in nevada? >> trump, according to recent polls is the favorite in nevada. it's a caucus. so who really knows. the ground game matters. trump has spent a lot of time in vegas and his name is on the top
of a hotel there so he's well known. i think what this whole cruz brouhaha does is it reinforces a pre-existing condition which is the story line that cruz is a liar, which, like many things in this campaign, the tempo was set by donald trump who originally called cruz a liar. then rubio sort of picked it up and ran with the same theme. and cruz found himself on the defensive to the point where today he had to fire someone and i think as a result, he may have sort of stoked the flames of the story line rather than extinguishing it. >> what do you think about this, autumn. you heard from ken cuccinelli. this isn't what they think about. >> here in nevada, gloria brought it up. it's about the ground game and issues that matter to nevada voters. ted cruz put out a vote saying he wants to return federal lands.
anyone from nevada knows 85% of nevada's lands are owned by the federal government. it's smart for ted cruz and marco rubio said at a rally that we want to return those lands to the nevadans. it's going to be interesting to see what plays out. one thing that needs to be said is donald trump's popularity, maybe a tower in the south but he's not as popular as people think. in a state where the ground game is crucial, the rubio and cruz campaign are much more organized and they've been here doing the work for months that's trump should have been doing back in october. >> do you think trump is vulnerable? >> yeah. i think donald trump is trying to continue in many of these, test the old model with his new model. the idea that you can go in there and dominate earned media, that you can dominate the local television coverage, that the momentum at a critical time like this is probably more important than whether or not you have people out knocking on doors.
so it's -- that, when he tried to test that approach in iowa, he didn't win. but now that he's got the momentum with big wins in new hampshire and south carolina, i think he does have a certain advantage. he has the wind at his back as he goes into nevada. >> you are expecting record turnout? >> yeah, we go to the rallies. you see the candidates, their events. we're going to have an all-time high. cruz and rubio will be the reason we have that high turnout. they are getting their support together. i just don't see and kevin talked about the wind at the back of donald trump. i don't see as he won south carolina with 30%. i see that 65% of south carolina did not vote for donald trump. you look around the country. he's really hit a ceiling. he's going to have an issue going into super tuesday. if he starts losing some of the southern states, there's a big issue in the trump campaign. >> as long as there are multiple other candidates out there, the vote not going to trump is
divided. >> right. conversely, rubio has to start winning somewhere. trump may lose somewhere but rubio has to start winning. and that's, you know, that's really his issue. and rubio has coalesced or the beginnings of the so-called establishment coalescing around rubio. some of the jeb bush money. former donors for jeb may go to rubio, and that's good for him. he's organized but he is still in this tight race with cruz over second place. and at some point, you have to win somewhere. and rubio hasn't won anywhere yet. and he -- somebody who spent his childhood in nevada, right? he has a story to tell in that state which he's been telling about growing up there to a degree. so maybe the voters of nevada will see him in a way as a favorite son to a degree. >> kasich says he laughed about the idea of him getting out. how big a problem does he pose for rubio?
>> i think it depends on the state. if you look at nevada, john kasich and adam could probably attest to this. he's got limited organizations in some of these march 1 states. but the fact he has 8% or 9% in some of those states that marco rubio would love to have in order to take on donald trump, you know, he is an important factor. he's going to continue to look at march 15th, john kasich is, march 15th and his prospects in ohio. and that is a crucial window where marco rubio really has to consolidate some of that anti-trump or the alternative to trump vote if he's going to start to pick up the momentum he's going to need to start overcoming -- overtaking donald trump in the delicate fight. >> are you officially endorsing a candidate? >> well, i'm going to officially endorse the republican nominee.
and i think that nevadans are sophisticated voters that need to realize when they go to the caucus tomorrow they need to vote for the person that's actually conservative and not perpetuate the divisions. i'll attest to what kevin said about kasich. every candidate is in reno yesterday or today. o only candidate who hasn't come to nevada is john kasich. he's looking at the super tuesday states and hoping his donors can keep him well until mid-march to get those midwest states. >> i understand your entire family is muslim. what do you make of donald trump's comments about temporarily banning muslims from the united states? >> he has rudimentary knowledge of the constitution. the people came to this country for religious freedoms. the most un-american thing you can do is persecute someone for who they believe in. that's no better than the country my father came from. they are hanging people for worshiping a god that's not theirs.
we can decide that, hey, we're going to stick to the constitution and not do those things. i think voters have a lot to look at tomorrow. >> if trump is the nominee, would you support him? >> i'll support the republican nominee. and i think that what's more important than anything is making sure the clintons aren't allowed to move back into the white house. there's nothing that can be worse for american prosperity than a clinton administration. i think the republican nominee will be a true conservative that's willing to lead this country. thursday night, cnn republican debate from houston. wolf blitzer moderates. begins 8:30 on cnn. and bernie sanders amped up his attacks on hillary clinton's campaign financing. and what's in a name. donald trump's name. it's on buildings and properties around the world. the question is how much does he really own? drew griffin looks at that
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yes, we have superpacs, but that money is going to be used against republicans. well, guess what. turns out not to be the case. millions of dollars in superpac money is now being used against me. >> that's was not all, though. more from brianna keilar. >> reporter: bernie sanders is trying to regain his momentum fresh off a loss to hillary clinton in the nevada caucuses. >> i am delighted that secretary clinton month after month after month seems to be adopting more and more of the positions that we have advocated. that's good. and, in fact, is beginning to use a lot of the language and phraseology that we have. in fact, i think i saw a tv ad and thought it was me. >> reporter: sanders is going on the offensive tweeting about the lack of transcripts for clinton's paid speeches saying it's been 17 days, 16 hours and 32 minutes since hillary clinton
said she'd look into releasing her paid speeches to wall street. hillary clinton is riding high after her rebound win in nevada and hoping for another victory in saturday's south carolina primary. clinton has an 18-point lead over sanders in the palmetto state buoyed by her lead among black voters. and she's getting a little star power with
a new television ad voiced by actor morgan freeman. >> she says their names. trayvon martin, dontre hamilton. sandra bland. and makes their mothers' fight for justice her own. she speaks for a city poisoned by injustice. >> we need action now. >> reporter: even as clinton rebounds from her new hampshire loss. she acknowledged an area she needs to improve upon during "state of the union" this weekend.
>> there's been underlying questions that maybe is really in the back of people's minds. and that is, is she in it for us or for herself? i think that's a question that people are trying to sort through. >> reporter: sanders and clinton have their eyes on super tuesday next week when 11 states will hold democratic nominating contests. >> please do not come to me state by state and say is this the end of the world? we are in this campaign until the end. we have gone much faster, much further than any -- or many people would have believed possible. and with organizations like the ones behind me, we are going to do just great in this campaign. >> brianna joins us now. clinton was fund-raising in california today. she's heading back to south carolina tomorrow? >> she's having a forum in south carolina tomorrow. it's going to feature a lineup of mothers of young african-american men and women who have died.
many of them in police custody. she'll be joined by the mothers of trayvon martin, eric garner, sandra bland and jordan davis. she's trying to send a message with this lineup that she understands the concerns of the african-american community that is so key to a democratic win in south carolina. and specifically that she understands their concerns about criminal justice reform. >> she'll, obviously, be in the evening with senator sanders at our cnn town hall hosted by chris cuomo. what is he planning for tomorrow? >> he's in norfolk, virginia, which is interesting because he's not going to be in south carolina which, obviously, this reflects the realistic approach his campaign is taking that he really is facing steep odds there. he was in massachusetts today. massachusetts and virginia, both of them are super tuesday states. he's kind of looking more toward super tuesday and past south carolina because he's facing a 20-point deficit almost in the polls there to hillary clinton. >> brianna, thank you. digging deeper with donna
brazile. donna, as you heard in the wake of the nevada results, sanders says clinton is starting to sound more like him. is that fair? >> there's no question that these candidates will find each other reading from the same music or same script. she is adopting some of the language in terms of income inequality. perhaps he's going to adopt some of her message as it relates to racial equality. i think they are singing from the same hymn book but often the person who made the record first would like to get the credit. >> latest poll of polls shows clinton's support among likely voters 25 points higher than sanders. do you believe she has that much of an advantage? >> i think it's going to be a close race. no question that secretary clinton understands what's at stake. south carolina is a whole new ball game. they are both looking for momentum going into super tuesday. she's campaigning in a familiar territory. the deep south.
she knows not just the issues but this is a woman who understands how to go to church and can read from the same hymn book. i'm not surprised she has a slight lead. i think the race will tighten. >> how important is winning south carolina for both of them? >> very important because super tuesday is around the corner. starting next month, we're going into what i call the biggest delegate prize of all. the states that will be held on super tuesday as well as the remaining states. 28 states total. over 1,000 delegates at stake. this is a key moment for both secretary clinton as well as senator sanders to get much-needed momentum before super tuesday. >> we're having a town hall forum for the democratic candidates in south carolina tomorrow night. chris cuomo is hosting it at 8:00. what do you think each of the candidates needs to cover? >> there's no question that tomorrow night secretary clinton has the opportunity to try to narrow the gap with young voters. so far they're not supporting her.
they're supporting her opponent. and senator sanders has an opportunity to begin to sing from that hymn book to diversify his support and begin to attract the kind of delegates he needs to become the nominee. >> even if he's not winning, sanders has raised an awful lot of money from in small donations. he's focused on super tuesday votes, planning to stay the course well after south carolina. >> his message has resonated with so many new voters. i believe he still has a shot at winning the nomination. as you know with jeb bush, it's not just money. it's message. it has to resonate to a more diverse electorate he'll face in south carolina and beyond. >> in order for him to actually have a path to victory over clinton, he's got to diversify. >> he has to diversify. the democratic coalition mirrors the american public. over 60% of our voters are white and 40% are people of color.
blacks, hispanic, asian, pacific islanders. you have to have a diversified message in order to win the nomination. >> donna, thanks very much. donna brazile. >> thank you. tune in tomorrow night with bernie sanders and hillary clinton when they take questions in the south carolina democratic town hall. it airs at 8:00 p.m. eastern here. donald trump talks about how good he is at making deals. man said they got a raw deal buying into trump properties that aren't owned by trump. how do robots work? ♪ you need a team... ...working together... ♪ ...doing all kinds of jobs. and the best place to find the job that's right for you is on the world's number-one job site.
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donald trump is a billionaire, successful real estate mogul. some question how real some of that real estate is. there are buildings that bear the trump name but actually are not owned by donald trump and that surprises some buyers. drew griffin reports. >> we're going to start winning so much that you're going to be sick and tired of winning. you're going to get bored with winning. >> reporter: donald trump isn't short on bravado. it's one thing that's helped make him into a multibillionaire.
whether you are planning to vote for him or buy from him, there's some fine print you may want to read. >> we were given a brochure that said that, you know, this was the best property he had ever developed. >> donald trump? >> yes. >> so that clearly in your mind was a donald trump property. donald trump involved. donald trump built. >> no question whatsoever. >> reporter: that's jay michael goodson who is suing donald trump. the trump condo project he bought into failed. goodson lost his money, and trump, well, trump was able to walk away because it turns out all things trump are not the same. south florida developer daniel levinson ought to know. he helped finish this trump hollywood. a super luxurious sold-out trump named condo project just south of ft. lauderdale.
>> particularly in the luxury residential sector, there are very few brands that compete. >> reporter: levinson took over this project when it wasn't doing so well. he licensed donald trump's name and used the trump family input which he said was instrumental to almost every detail. n when it was time to actually sell the units, well, he used trump himself. >> donald trump came to the relaunch. and i believe ivanka attended an event. >> do people believe they are buying a trump-developed property? >> i guess beauty is in the eye of the beholder, they say. i don't know what each of the buyers is thinking, but i imagine there's an association that trump is involved. and they are. >> reporter: involved, yes, but in development after development, buyers are learning their trump property isn't actually a trump-owned building. levinson just licensed the name. which means even if things go
south, donald trump makes money. he keeps the licensing fees and if the development goes well, he makes even more money. >> they made millions of dollars on the project by having the name associated with. so every time that there was a transaction, a condominium closed, they got paid as well. >> pretty smart. >> i think it's brilliant, yeah. >> reporter: brilliant when it all works which brings us back to j. michael goodson and the ft. lauderdale condo he said he thought he was buying from donald trump. >> what does the first page say? a signature development by donald j. trump. >> it's been a decade since goodson lost a $345,000 deposit on a nearly $2 million condo at the trump international tower in ft. lauderdale. >> you were up on this side on pool level? >> exactly. right there. >> reporter: the project failed.
it went on to be built by a new developer under a different name. trump who had licensed his name removed it and kept the fee. goodson, a hugely successful businessman himself, sued saying he had no idea trump could just walk away from a building that, after all, was sold to him as a trump tower. at issue in the court battle that ensued, what was a trump property and what was a trump licensed property? details found on page 14 of the prospectus which donald trump had to borrow the judge's glasses to read. >> could i use your glasses again, your honor? >> i remember that. i remember, it was pretty fine print. >> well, it's not fine print. >> alan garden is donald trump's attorney. >> the disclosure of the roles of the parties was very clear to anyone who would read them. a lot of people, probably mr. goodson himself, got so caught up in the frenzy of the real estate market, they thought that
they were, you know, too good for the contracts. >> reporter: this is how donald trump explained his role in a deposition. >> the word developing, it doesn't mean that we're the developer. we are -- the word developing, i mean, we worked on the documents. we worked on the room sizes and things but didn't give out the contracts. we didn't get into financing. we weren't the developer, but we did work with the developer. >> developing doesn't mean developer? >> developing is a -- a developer is a specific person or entity who is the person ultimately responsible for the project. donald trump and the trump organization was not the developer. >> we the jury find as follows for the defendant. >> goodson lost the lawsuit, badly. even forced to pay trump's attorney's fees. he's appealing. >> why are you pursuing this? >> i think somebody needs to pursue it. it was a major rip-off, and i
think a lot of the investors don't have a legal background. they don't know what's involved. maybe it's been more involved than i've anticipated. he said he's going to build a fence in mexico but he couldn't handle a hotel in ft. lauderdale, florida. >> we hear this time and time again from people who feel i went to a cocktail party. donald trump was there. telling me this is going to be a great development. that's they were truly under the spell that donald trump was developing this property. i mean, honestly, you don't think that there isn't some kind of a bait and switch here? >> there's no bait and switch and people have to be accountable for their own decisions. >> reporter: daniel levinson successfully finished his licensed project with donald trump, sold out and walked away with millions. >> some trump product is trump product that his team is developing. some they are the branding and licensing arm.
>> reporter: all of it disclosed in the contracts, he says, whether the super rich bother to read them or not. >> caveat emptor, let the buyer beware. >> how common that people buying into trump properties find out they aren't buying a trump property. if they read the contract, they'd find this out? >> you really have to read those contracts deeply. there have been similar lawsuits like this in tampa, hawaii, baja, mexico, toronto. the buyers claim donald trump was the developer until they find out he wasn't. if you go to the trump organization website, the list of these properties, there's a little tab for a disclaimer that's you can open up and that is where you find out the property is actually not being developed by donald trump just named after him. >> is there a fear this campaign is going to hurt his brand, his image in these high-end developments? >> i don't think anyone really knows. the people who love him, the developers who worked with him, they think any publicity is
going to be good publicity for the business. then you have people that really despise him and hoping he fails and, should he win, he turns that business over to his kids and they run it. but forecasting what's going to happen to his business is like forecasting this campaign. that is tough to do. >> drew griffin, thanks. just ahead, a battle between apple and the government. the fbi wants the company to help them break into the iphone of the deceased san bernardino shooter. why apple says this is about more than just one phone, next.
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this next story has become part of the 2016 campaign. also implications that's transcended the legal battle over the san bernardino shooter's iphone. apple ceo tim cook says if he goes along with the government's wishes to break into it, it would threaten everyone's civil liberties. apple says it's about privacy and safety. donald trump has called for a boy cost apple products and other candidates have weighed in as well. >> we can't have data that can tell us about an attack on our families and someone is like, i have a business model and that won't work. >> it will take a partnership
between the technology industry and the government to confront and solve this. >> i think that apple and probably a lot of other people don't necessarily trust the government. >> i am very fearful in america about big brother. on the other hand, what i always worry about is the possible ut of another terrorist attack against our country. >> what i think you ought to do is boycott apple until such time as they give that security number. how do you like that? i just thought of that. boycott apple. >> i believe apple, nobody has the right to defy a legal search warrant. >> evan perez joins me with the latest. apple is saying it's not just this one phone. essentially they have to create new software that would allow a back door that would make everybody's phone potentially vulnerable to hackers if it got out.
>> that's right. they are also pointing out it really won't stop at this phone. the fbi says it's about this one phone. we know other law enforcement agencies will come knocking on the door of apple to help them unlock phones. you are already seeing that in some places, especially in manhattan. the two sides are fighting over whether this entire dispute could have been avoided if someone hadn't meddled with the government-owned cell phone that farook carried. it was backing up information to the icloud until just a month before the san bernardino terrorist attacks. and apple officials say the fbi could have gotten the missing phone data by restarting the backups to the cloud but that option failed because in the hours after the attacks, san bernardino county officials changed the apple i.d. password on the phone. farook was a county employee and the county owned the phone. >> that's was a mistake. does that change things in this case? >> apple says yes. the fbi says even with the data
from the cloud, investigators would still need to get to the phone itself. the fbi spokesperson said, quote, even if the password had not been changed and apple could have turned on the auto backup and loaded it to the cloud there might have been information on the phone that would not be accessible without apple's assistance. we know that this is going to be a part of apple's court filing challenging this order from a judge to help the fbi. we expect that filing to come any day now. and, obviously, this is a big issue we expect is going to be fought all the way to the supreme court. just ahead, they've been campaigning, debating for months. but how much attention are voters paying? do candidates recognize their names and faces at this point? think of it as a seven seat theater... for an action packed thriller.
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technology entire countries w if they could ever catch you. with presidential candidates holding rallies, running ads, e-mails, tweeting, you would think people would at least know their names. you would be wrong. >> reporter: at the black bear diner in las vegas -- it's pancakes, served up with a side of politics. are you ready to play candidate trivia?
>> yeah. >> reporter: let's do it. we put voters to the test to see how much they know about the data day before nevada republican caucus. tony started off strof. >>s the one and only mr. trump. >> reporter: when i showed him a picture of ted cruz, he didn't know his name. watch what happened when i showed him a photo of this candidate. >> who is this? >> that looks like elliott spitzer. [ laughter ] is that him? >> no. it's definitely no. >> the love bug they call him. >> reporter: with this candidate i got a blank stare. >> do you want to ask your pal over here? >> yeah. john kasich. >> you don't even know the name. you have the answer and you don't know. >> john kasich's photo stumpled nearly everyone we asked. who is this? >> is that john from ohio? >> john from ohio. i like that.
do you know his last name? >> i do not. >> kucinich? >> nope. want to try again? >> no, not that one. >> his initials are j.k. does that help you at all? >> jack kemp? >> jack kemp? my goodness. >> reporter: this first time voter clearly has to study up. >> who is this? >> um, marco rubio? >> no. teddy cruz. >> 18-year-old whitney also had a whole lot of trouble with kasich. >> i think he is a movie star. >> what move was he in, do you know? >> no, i don't know. >> he's a governor of a state and he is running for president. >> i did not know that. >> but she does know movie stars. >> who is that? >> george clooney. >> you know george clooney but you don't know john kasich.
>> her dad didn't do much better. >> i'm not sure about that guy. he's not currently running, right? >> what if i told you he was? how would you feel? >> i would be embarrassed. >> some voters couldn't recall which candidates were in which party. and if they were even still running. this guy got bernie sanders and jeb bush confused. >> you think that's jeb bush. >> as far as the face? i have -- >> no clue. >> no clue to the faces. >> okay. the initials are b.s. does that help you? >> is he [ bleep ]? no. isn't that what most politicians are? >> reporter: considering this group's track record, it is no surprise even this photo threw them off. >> who is it? >> i know he's on cnn but i don't know his name. >> he's on cnn. what show does he do? what time he's on?
>> is not it like at the night? isn't it nighttime? >> that's our vice president. >> no, it isn't. >> who is that? >> biden. >> okay. your daughter thought he had a show on cnn. >> he kind of looks like anderson cooper. >> what? wow, okay. >> i didn't see the resemblance. it sounds like a few of these candidates are fighting for voters, at least in terms of the identities. >> absolutely. everyone knew ben carson. but carly fiorina, people didn't know she was out of the campaign and didn't remember her last name. not a single person knew who john kasich was. and then the cruz-rubio situation. not only are they battling for second base but also to be recognized. as i play this candidate trivia around the country, so many people think ted cruz is marco
rubio and vice versa. one of them has to break through. >> thank you very much. we'll be right back. my computer's dying again. you'll need to email us so we can issue you a ticket. but you're right here. it's protocol. or, you can try staples tech services next day guarantee. it's fast and done right. i'll do that instead. that's not protocol marsha. in by noon, out by 5 the next day. staples. make more happen.
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caucuses. ted cruz due to speak soon in reno. we're going to bring you both events as they happen. so make sure you keep it right here. this is "cnn tonight." i'm don lemon. the big political bombshell today. cruz fires one of his top staffers for spreading a false story questioning marco rubio's faith. that's after trump and rubio both blast the cruz campaign for dirty tricks. meanwhile, rubio picks up a slew of endorsements today. the race for the nomination really heating up as we count down to super tuesday. here's where we stand right now. okay? donald trump leads the republican pack with 68 delegates, far ahead of the rest. but 1,237 delegates are needed to win. so he has a ways to go in all of this. meanwhile, on the democratic side hillary clinton leads with 497 delegates. bernie sanders has 69. 2,383 delegates needed to clinch the democratic nomination. and here's where it gets really interesting. a lot of delegates are up for grabs on super tuesday when 12 states vote. so there's a lot to get to. let's get straight to cnn's jim
acosta with the trump campaign. so jim, the latest cnn/orc poll taken even before trump's big win in south carolina shows him with a commanding lead in nevada. people are asking if he is unstoppable. what is it like there tonight? >> it's a good question, don. and it is another big crowd for donald trump here in las vegas. i can tell you that sheriff joe arpaio from arizona is in the house. so you can bet that immigration is going to come up here later on in just a few moments. as you were just saying, the math tells us that trump can still be stopped. he is way ahead in delegates. that's true. and each time he wins big like he did in new hampshire and south carolina, it just gets that much harder for the other candidates to catch up. and the polls show he should cruise to another victory here in nevada. but don, keep in mind while the trump campaign is confident about its chances here, his advisers are well aware of what happened in iowa. trump was leading in the polls in iowa but he ended up taking second place. >> you know, jim, trump has been
ruthless in taking on cruz but rubio is gaining strength. is trump turning up the heat on marco rubio now? >> reporter: well, clearly donald trump views marco rubio as a threat. he has spent most of the day going after ted cruz because of the firing of his communications director rick tyler. but keep in mind over the weekend donltd trump retweeted that tweet over the weekend questioning whether rubio was eligible to be president even though rubio was clearly born in the united states. the trump campaign is basically saying what you see on twitter, that caveat, retweets do not equal endorsements. after what happened with ted cruz today. you can see this donald trump event is just getting started here. after what happened to ted cruz today, don, now you have both donald trump and marco rubio basically tag-teaming the texas senator, slamming him as dishonest. that is going to be very difficult for ted cruz to deal with over the coming days, don. >> all right. jim acosta. jim is in las vegas.
donald trump is about to speak. we'll get you some of that when it happens. thank you, jim. now let's bring in sun lynn safari. a bombshell on the campaign trail. ted cruz firing his communications director rick tyler. you heard jim mention that. what's the latest on this? how's the mood on the campaign? >> reporter: the mood's not great at all, don. this is not what the cruz campaign wants to be focused on 24 hours before caucus night here in nevada. this all started on sunday when rick tyler, then communications director, tweeted an article, a link to an article, which talks about how marco rubio is disparaging and trashing the bible. that article misquoted marco rubio. actually was praising the bible instead. well, rick tyler took down that tweet overnight on sunday night into today. he apologized. and then thought it was done. but not so much. rick tyler was fired very quickly today by senator cruz. here he is today explaining why he called directly for rick tyler's resignation.
>> yesterday a staffer from our campaign sent out a tweet that tweeted a news story that purported to indicate marco saying something negative about the bible. the news story was false. that staffer deleted the tweet, apologized, and pulled it down. although i spent this morning investigating what happened. and this morning i asked for rick tyler's resignation. i had made clear in this campaign that we will conduct this campaign with the very highest standards of integrity. >> reporter: and i thought that was so notable what you heard right there from senator cruz, really injecting himself personally into this story. you heard him say "i called for 4iz resignation after i did this investigation." very clearly the candidate himself here, don, really trying to regain control of his campaign. >> yeah, absolutely. so sun lynn, donald trump called cruz a world-class liar. that's a quote. and rubio's campaign issued this
statement today. said "rick is a very good spokesman who had the unenviable task of working for a candidate willing to do or say anything to do get elected. there's a culture in the cruz campaign top to bottom that no lie is too big and no trick too dirty 37 rick did the right thing by apologizing to marco. it's high time for ted cruz to do the right thing and stop the lies." the question is how worried is the cruz campaign that these charges are sticking, that he is being branded a liar? >> reporter: i think they're increasingly aware and increasingly sensitive to this fact, don, and i think we saw that reflected in how swiftly, how quickly they moved today to try to button up this controversy. this sort of narrative has been increasingly surrounding their campaign. at least for the last week. both for marco rubio. both from donald trump. really claiming that the campaign is one that's really founded on lies and missteps and fraud. so rick tyler's tweet played into that narrative perfectly. i think they are very aware that
the cruz campaign needed to move quickly to squash this story. >> sunlen serfaty. thank you very much. i appreciate it. i want to bring in hugh hewitt. today is hugh's birthday. he is 25 years old. so naturally you chose to spend it here with our viewers, right? >> yeah. i woke up this morning and mike allen's playbook saying happy 60th birthday. so i've gotten more birthday wishes than i have in the previous 59 years so thank you. >> i always say i'm celebrating the anniversary. so the 30th anniversary of your 30th birthday. >> you know, donald trump has proven as has hillary clinton that we get to work as long as we want. they're both 68, 69. they're bundles of energy. if they can keep running for president, we can keep commentating. >> absolutely. what a birthday present. your radio show, you spoke to them. did they give you any headlines? >> i think the headline for ted cruz is that he grew up speaking
spanish and wanted to clear that up and that he fired rick tyler. he thought it was unfortunate but he needed to. and he's not worried about the narrative. he is leaning into the narrative, liar, liar, liar, and taking it on. which is what you have to do. there's an old adage in politics, which is hang a lantern on your problem. but there's another old adage. lee atwater, the late great lee atwater, that said when your opponent is on the ground with a broken arm step on it. so donald trump and marco rubio stepped on it today. they're going to try to continue to drive this story as far as they can. also had ben carson on today. he has forgiven ted cruz for the iowa brouhaha. and said so. but donald trump joined me after ben was on. he said look -- he brought up the ben carson thing. and he went after ted cruz really hard. even though it's kind of counterintuitive to me. he wants to keep cruz alive and dividing the ant-trump vote. but he might end up breaching the firewall and taking him out. >> hugh, let's listen to some of trump from your interview. >> we've had a lot of problems with him.
he is a person who doesn't like telling the truth. and i just find it hard to believe that some of the things he said. so he plays hard ball. and i like hard ball. and i've met a lot tougher people than him, many, many many times tougher. but he has a real hard time with the truth. >> and ted cruz obviously responding the way he did. he's worried, as i said to sunlen, that this may be sticking. >> oh, he's very. a narrative like this takes hold. it got a hold of nixon early in his career and he had to fight it the rest of his career. it doesn't mean you can't beat it but you would rather be talking about the constitutional issues by the scalia opening. donald trump said he wants a scalia reincarnation for his nomination for the court. ted cruz would rather talk about that than firing his spokesperson. and giving marco rubio an opportunity to go out as you noted earlier in the broadcast. rubio had this day where he collected more endorsements and money. all of the jeb people seem to have gone to marco rubio. a lot of people leaning on john kasich to get out.
the ohio governor will not get out until ohio. i've known john kasich a long time. but i do think the big story of the day is donald trump's going to win tomorrow in nevada. john rauls-to-be and others say that. he's going to win big. your poll confirms that. and can ted cruz keep his firewall in texas on super tuesday? and our debate thursday night will have a lot to do with that. it's going to be sparky. oh, is it going to be sparky. >> sparky. you mentioned john kasich. he spoke to wolf blitzer today about what you mentioned. listen to this. >> are they privately urging you to drop out? >> no, i haven't heard from any of the special interests to get me to drop out. in fact, we're signing people up. we're signing up some significant republican fund-raisers. and our political organization is expanding as well. we're going to keep going. because when i travel places, people beg me. they say you stay in. you represent hope for me and my family. this is all sort of political mumbo-jumbo from people who, you know, i don't even know who they are. the fact is, we're just going to
keep going. and at some point when we get the consolidation, i'm very hopeful it will be toward me. >> so you think he will stay in till ohio at least. >> i do. >> but you don't think there's pressure? you don't think it is time for him to make room for someone else? that's the conventional wisdom. >> there are people in the party who want behind out. but he did pick up a couple of hedge fund guys today and made some money. here's what john kasich is. he is who he is. he got there through hard work and beating odds. he won in congress. i think he was the only republican to win the year that he won. it might have been 1982. john kasich has always been a long odds guy. he's tough as nails. and he's happy. he's a happy warrior. he is not going anywhere. an open convention is a real possibility, unless donald trump takes out ted cruz in texas and marco rubio in florida.
if he does that, i think he's pretty much unstoppable. but i don't see that happening. i'm a fairly traditional guy. i think home state favorite sons win their state an sent extraordinary circumstances. so this debate could be very, very big and there are some issues that are troubling for donald trump. i asked him about his tax returns today, and they still haven't been reproduced. he said they'll get there eventually. the pressure is on him to release that and to get more specific about his answers. >> so at this point no clear runaway. trump is stoppable to you at this point and you still believe it to be an open convention. >> yes. i don't think there's any -- no way in heck to predict what's going to happen. but the odds makers and the bet takers show donald trump with a 50% probability and marco rubio with a 40% probability. they have kasich in low, high single digits and ted cruz a little higher than that. that reflects a divided field in which the possibilities are enless. only ben carson doesn't have a path.
he said his path is to hope they all break to him. that's kind of a long ball. four people could be the nominee. we'll find out more thursday night. >> do you want to predict nevada? you know i have to ask. >> no, you got me to predict south carolina. i got it right, thank goodness. but i put the crystal ball away. i got it exactly right. yeah. >> you know how you -- >> on your show. >> yeah, you did. you know why we're similar? a week from tomorrow, i'll be celebrating with you. i'll be 27. >> oh, really? >> yeah. that's a joke. a lot older than 27. thank you, hugh. happy birthday. always good to see you. >> thank you, don. stay with cnn for all of this week's big political events. tomorrow night hillary clinton and bernie sanders take questions from south carolina voters. cnn's town hall moderated by our very own chris cuomo starts at 8:00 eastern. and thursday night it is the last debate before super tuesday. the cnn presidential debate in houston moderated by our very own wolf blitzer beginning at 8:30 eastern. when we come back, the big shake-up at the cruz campaign. will it change voters' minds about the candidates?
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how does rock and roll work? it takes all kinds of jobs. and the best place to find the job that's right for you is on the world's number-one job site. indeed. how the world works. ted cruz fires a top aide for posting a video that falsely showed marco rubio disparaging the bible. is the cruz campaign in trouble? let's discuss it with matt
lewis, senior contributor to the daily caller and author of "too dumb to fail." republican writer and commentator kaley mcineny. and matt schlapp, former political director for george w. bush. i want to show everyone what we're talking about. so they'll know this is the wrong video -- it's the video that has the wrong captions, right? that rick tyler tweeted out. and of course, marco rubio, of course, ted cruz has said you know that, this is awful and he's fired him. let's listen to it right now. >> this is a lot. >> okay. so first to you, matt. you say the cruz campaign may need a reboot. this being one of the reasons. was cruz asking for his spokesman's resignation, was that enough to change the narrative here? >> well, i think he's trying to make the point that these
charges, that maybe having some kind of rogue campaign tactics won't be accepted by the candidate. and when the candidate gets in these situations he's got to do something to set the stage and kind of reboot, as i said. i think that's what ted is trying to do and i think this is the right step to try to get that done. >> let's show how marco rubio reacted to the campaign's initial apology. here it is. >> for them to take a video and to transcribe words on it that are the complete opposite of what i said, it's incredibly disturbing. you guys have to be seeing this. every single day something come out of the cruz campaign that's deceptive and untrue. >> so matt lewis, you defended ted cruz after his campaign implied that dr. carson was dropping out after iowa. is this time different for you? >> it is. because it's a pattern now, right? so you have the thing with ben carson. and i said look, campaigns, you err on the side of being aggressive. i give the benefit of the doubt
to the political staffer who is trying to be aggressive. who maybe crosses the line. but now we've had so many other examples. we had, for example, the cruz we had, for example, the cruz we had, for example, the cruz we had, for example, the cruz campaign did a -- i guess it was a mail piece where there was a picture of marco rubio shaking hands with president obama which didn't happen. it was photoshopped. and now you have this latest example. this is a pattern and it's really bad for ted cruz. he had a rough day in south carolina on saturday. losing evangelicals to donald trump. now going into nevada tomorrow, he has this happen. so it's a really bad couple of days for ted cruz. >> okay. kaley, let's talk more about cruz and trump. trump, he shot off a few tweets about this. and he's still clearly -- he's a bit miffed. he felt he was burned in iowa. he tweeted, "ted cruz should be disqualified from his fraudulent win in iowa. rnc and republican leadership probably won't let this happen. sad."
at one point donald trump was holding the threat of a third-party run over their heads. does he not need to anymore as the clear front-runner do this or hold that over their heads? >> i think it's important for him to press ted cruz on these issues because as matt just point out this is something we've seen happen repeatedly, from the push polls to the voter violation form to the odd reporting of ben carson or misreporting of ben carson dropping out. it's a repeated narrative we're seeing out of the cruz campaign of lying and distortion. and look, i think donald trump hammering this message home along with marco rubio about these shady tactics helped them because look, ted cruz underperformed in south carolina and you have to ask yourself why. his policies didn't change, his message didn't change. what changed was the narrative of his campaign, lying and doing these dirty tricks. so i think he's got to keep driving this point home until ted cruz really changes what he's doing. >> south carolina he won but they still think he ran the -- i
don't know. i guess the most unfair campaign. there it is up on the screen. 39, i believe that. >> yeah. it was very unfair. ted cruz, he put out push-pulls. >> no. they believe that donald trump ran the most unfair campaign. ted cruz was second. >> yeah, no, but obviously donald trump was not running an unfair campaign. name for me one tactic that was in the media being reported on the part of donald trump running an unfair campaign. i don't think any of us on this panel can name one thing donald trump did that was unfair. we might not like what he said about george w. bush but nothing he did was unfair. i think it is this narrative of ted cruz holding up the bible. but then lying about policies, lying about rubio and the picture. i think that really struck evangelicals the wrong way. which is why you saw evangelicals break for trump. >> matt, nothing unfair, matt schlepp? >> i think we're getting a little carried away. i think we have some tactics from a campaign that were over the line.
by the way, we're going to see this from all the campaigns. i think ted cruz took responsibility for it and tried to make changes. i think every one of these campaigns is going to try to push their competitors. you know, they all want to win. there's going to be some dirty tactics along the way. but let's not get over the top about this. the reason why donald trump won evangelicals in south carolina is not because they think ted cruz is a bad guy. it's because donald trump's message is connecting with evangelicals. and i think that's the part that is more important. >> listen, trump is piling on. he's accusing ted cruz of dirty tricks. but you also have trump starting to signal that rubio might not be eligible to run for president. i mean, that seemed to work at least somewhat, don't you think it did, matt lewis? >> i think it worked against ted cruz. for a variety of reasons. trump likes to dominate the news cycle and change the topic. and it worked there.
i think he woos trying to oth otherize ted cruz. remind people he is cuban and not a lot of evangelicals come from cuba, apparently. i think it worked in iowa. i don't think that it will work in a place like nevada. and i don't know that it's going to work against marco rubio. we know he was born in america. and donald trump said the same thing. or tweeted something very similar to that. not that long ago. so i don't know if it's going to resonate as much as did it against cruz. again, it's the second time he's trying this shtick as well. >> quickly, kayleigh. >> it is important to point out that he retweeted, it's not something he sent out. also important to point out the supreme court has never defined natural born citizen. until they do, no case is settled. >> explain this to me. if you retweet something, you still didn't send it out? >> no. he did not question rubio. he retweeted something and his explanation was, i sent things out to my 14 million folks within my social media networks. and it's up to them to vet it. he retweeted it. he put the thought out there. and people can 1307bd and talk
about it as they please. it's not necessarily an affirmation or saying it's verifiable. it's putting it out there. the question is why, though. there was questioning on the sunday shows about why he would retweet white supremacists as well. because you know, saying that i didn't send it out, he still had to hit the send button. >> he didn't know anyone he tweeted out was white supremacist. no candidate in this race, certainly not donald trump, would ever knowingly retweet a white supremacist. when you retweet anyone who's a fannish. >> but kayleigh, are the standards a little higher? to be honest, donald trump is running for leader of the free world. aren't the standards a little higher for him or a lot higher? >> no. what people love about donald trump is that he does engage with everyday people and he can't vet every single person he retweets, he can't vet every single person -- >> if you can't and you're running for president, should you not retweet then if you can't vet the person? >> i don't think it's important to vet the people he retweets. i think he's putting their thoughts out there. and that's why people love him. he's putting what the american people say out there and giving everyone a platform. >> okay. everyone, stay with me.
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tomorrow the gop spotlight turns to nevada where donald trump is hoping to extend his winning streak. back with me now to discuss, matt qulus, kayleigh mcaneny and matt schlapp. matt, donald trump has a big lead when it comes to delegates. here he is taking a victory lap. look at this. >> we won with everything. we won with women. i love the women. we won with men. i'd rather win with women, to be honest. we won with evangelicals. like unbelievable. we won with the military. we won with highly educated, pretty well educated and poorly educated. but we won with everything. tall people, short people, fat people, skinny people, just won. >> so he won with everybody.
trump has 68. cruz has 11. rubio has 9. 30 delegates are at stake in nevada. how do you think he's going to do? >> i think he will win nevada but he still, you have to get 1,237 delegates. so he's still only a fraction of the way there. so he's really looking good but he's got a long way to go. things could change. i've been an advocate of trying to get trump one on one. i think he has a ceiling that he can't get to 50%. but that looks like it's not going to happen. i have a new strategy that is somewhat unseemly but maybe now to the point of desperation. >> politics and unseemly? what is that? >> this is a theory born out of desperation. it's based on the premise that you cannot get the republican candidates, the non-trump candidates to drop out for the good of the party. so what you do is you have this -- you conspire and you
allow ted cruz to win texas. so nobody else competes for texas. cede that to ted cruz. you cede florida to marco rubio. and you cede ohio to john kasich. and the hope is that they can deprive donald trump from winning those delegates and keeping him from getting the 1,237 he would need. this would force potentially, force -- what hugh hewitt has been talking about for months now, an open convention. >> so listen. so who's the master planner here? and who all gets together and does it? is it the rnc? what happens? and how do you get them all together? >> i think this has to be the campaigns. there are no broker. that's why i don't say a brokered convention. i don't think anyone else can make this -- there are no party bosses and smoke-filled back rooms. >> matt, this is why you're a journalist. because actually, what happens in these campaigns is they're all self-interested. and that's why people stay in races. and they have -- they're raising tons of money. and they're not going to get out.
and the fact is this. if somebody wants to deprive donald trump of the nomination, they have to start beating donald trump. and what we saw in south carolina, donald trump has his usual flair at his event in atlanta the other night. but he won almost every area of the state. and what you have to do if you want to challenge the front-runner, you have to win noo in these counties, win congressional districts. and you're going to have to win some states. it's pretty basic. >> how do you do that? because the only one who had been really taking on donald trump directly but i wasn't doing it well, as best he could, was jeb bush. now jeb bush is out. do you think others need to take him on and start running for second and third place and declaring victory when they actually lost? >> yeah, i think, don, i think the big mistake jeb bush made, and i'm an admirer of jeb bush but the big mistake he made was to somehow scold voters that they were doing something wrong by supporting donald trump. and what he should have done is listened to what donald trump is saying needs to be done to fix our politics.
and listen to the message and try to steal those supporters. and that's the strange thing that's happening. donald trump isn't getting all the support because it's this cult of personality which some people like to report. he's getting the report because something he is doing and saying is resonating. smart candidates should copy that. >> but matt, he is winning, i'll grant you that, but he's winning with 30% of the vote or something. so those 2/369 republicans -- here's my point, though, about this strategy. the strategy -- >> your strategy will never work. it will never work. >> what they're doing now isn't working. >> matt lewis, you know why your strategy will never work? because there's a guy named donald trum whop by the way in florida, in marco rubio and jeb bush's state in the last poll was polling at 40%. jeb was at 4. >> that's my point. he's polling at 40%. >> this is in florida. >> exactly. and in a field of six people. >> that's my point. >> when you look at south carolina -- >> i appreciate you making my
points for me. >> if you look at total votes for marco rubio from jeb bush and john kasich, it's greater than trump's 33%. do you think he'll be able to maintain this lead, especially as the field continues to narrow? kayleigh, go ahead. >> for sure because you look when these candidates drop out there's this flawed conventional wisdom that their voting bloc will be this monolithic voting bloc that goes to another candidate. so people are saying jeb's out, that's all going to rubio, cruz is out, that's all going to trump. the problem is it's not bearing out in the numbers. jeb bush's supporters, their choices are split between donald trump and marco rubio and ted cruz. they're going to spread out the wealth and it's only going to serve to bolster donald trump. it's the conventional wisdom that's going to help when all these people drop out. i don't think that's the case. >> that's going to have to be the last word. kayleigh and mattschlapp. matt lewis and matt schlapp.
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south carolina clinton is hoping african-american voters can deliver her an even bigger win. let's discuss now. marlon marshall, director of states and political engagement with the hillary clinton campaign. so good to have you. thank you for coming on. >> good to be here. i'm in south carolina. it's awesome to be with you. >> the clinton campaign released
a new ad targeting black voters in south carolina and beyond. here it is. >> she says their names. trayvon martin. >> trayvon martin. shot to death. >> dondra hamilton. >> unarmed. >> did nothing wrong. >> and make their mothers' fight for justice their own. she speaks for a city poisoned by indifference. >> we need action now. >> and stands with the president against those who would undo his achievements. just like she's always stood with us. hillary clinton. >> i'm hillary clinton and i approve this message. >> so marlon, that's morgan freeman's voice. it is the second time he has
voiced a clinton ad. that's like being endorsed by the voice of god. these ads have got to be pretty effective. are they? >> it's a very powerful ad. and part of that is we're honored to have the support of morgan freeman, a very recognizable voice. but the thing about the ad is that it raises up issues that are affecting communities of color. you've heard us talk a lot about breaking down barriers. and to have his voice lent to that is something that's very important. and hopefully will continue to resonate across the country and particularly here in south carolina as we lead into saturday. >> i spoke to morgan freeman last week when he -- when his first clinton ad came out. listen to what he had to say then. >> i don't think there is such a thing as a black vote, as a political monolith. you know. that's not going to be at work, the way it works this time. >> so he was saying that the issues are bigger than race or gender, that it's about who you can trust, who can do a better
job, but it sure looks like your campaign is going after the black vote. so how is it going to work this time? >> well, this is -- speaking to communities of color and african-americans is something she's been doing for over 25 years, from going out of law school and working for the children's defense fund actually right here in south carolina and then to alabama, to first lady in arkansas, to first lady in the united states of america and bringing the children's health insurance program, which insured a lot of african-american children. these are issues she's fought for her entire life and on this campaign since day one. we've talked about issues. we've talked about economic opportunity. her first policy speech was on ending the era of mass incarceration. we've talked about voting rights since day one. that's something the african-american community knows, something we have to keep telling because we want to earn everyone's support. but i think you saw in nevada when we had the support of the african-american community they trust hillary clinton, we wanted to make sure we keep talking about these issues.
>> today in boston bernie sanders talked about the black vote. listen. >> are we behind today in the african-american vote? the answer is yes, we are. but i would also tell you that we are making progress, and i believe we will continue to make progress. >> so you can't deny the sanders campaign has made up a lot of ground, made up a lot of ground when it comes to different types of voters. so do you think he can change, that turn the tide or close that gap with voters in south carolina, black voters in south carolina? >> well, you know, i know he's invested a lot of resources in south carolina. i don't think he's coming back to south carolina till the end of the week. and we're going to be here every day this week starting tomorrow. so again, from our standpoint, our job is to earn the support 69 f of the african-american community. that's why we're going to be here every day this week. that's why you're going to see us in super tuesday states. that's why we've talked about this issue since day one. >> how about the success he's had with young people?
can your campaign stop younger black voters from moving over to bernie sanders? >> with the, you know, we want to reach out to all voters, particularly young voters. you've seen hillary travel to six historically black colleges and you universities throughout this campaign. she's going to south carolina state this weekend as well. from our standpoint we keep talking about the issues. we keep talking about economic opportunity. we keep talking about guns. that's one of the things the mothers are in town today. five mothers who've lost children to police violence and brutality. you saw those in the ad. if we keep talking about those things and keep reaching out to folks i think we're going to end up being successful as people here and trust the secretary and what she's going to bring as president. >> marlon marshall. thank you, sir. appreciate you culminaoming on. >> thanks for having me, don. appreciate it. >> coming up, black lives matter. black votes matter as well. but will black voters be the key to victory in south carolina?
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carolina state house, and also bob beck'll, the author of "i should be dead: my life surviving politics, tv and addiction." and van jones, cnn political krisht contributor. lets talk about the campaign add we saw in the previous segment. in the ad she ties herself to black victims and to their mothers, trayvon martin, deontre hamilton, sandra bland. does it make an effective case for a candidacy? >> listen, that is a brilliant, brilliant ad. i mean, if there's a center of the bullseye, if there's an atom at the center of the bullseye, if there's an electron on the atom, she hit it. that's going to be a textbook -- >> why do you say that? >> because it hits all of the buttons. in terms of the pain people are feeling. people don't understand. say her name is a hashtag that has come out of the black lives movement because they were
frustrated people wrb talking about the african-american women who have been victimized. it was a brilliant ad. and my frustration with the sanders campaign now is she's using morgan freeman's voice. you take that to the bank. bernie sanders has harry belafonte. where is his voice? you're almost in a situation now where bernie is almost being outclassed, outmaneuvered. he's got to be -- >> do you guys agree just quickly because i want to move on other things. do you agree this gets to all cylinders first? >> i think it's a very good ad and the right thing to say at the same time. >> go ahead, bakari. >> i've always said african-american women were going to be the driving force in south carolina and beyond. she hit that note hard in that ad. >> hillary clinton pulled out a win in las vegas. does she have her groove back, do you think, after nevada and is it moving in her favor to her
pain? >> definitely. she ha her swagger back for sure. >> we've seen the candidate get that much better along the campaign trail. she did yeoman's work in casinos late at night, meeting with culinary workers in nevada. she's in south carolina beginning tomorrow when bernie sanders isn't coming back until friday. i believe marlon marshall described that. she has campaign stops with these mothers. she's not taking anything for granted which kind of warms my spirit. there was this thought hillary clinton would rest on her laurels based on her relationship with the african-american community. but i think the large defeat she had in 2008 taught a lot of lessons. not just as van said this weekend rocking or cradling the black vote but instead talking about issues that truly matter and hitting on those venz excited again. >> but even request with you guys saying she hit on all
cylinders, supporters of bernie sanders say she is pandering, this is nothing but pandering to the black community and no one is better at it than hillary clinton. >> well, not to say that bernie doesn't pander himself to some constituencies. the fact sanders is not coming back until friday. the fact it's clear he has not handled the black vote at all. the majority of the turnout in south carolina is going to be african-american and she's going to win it. here's the real problem for sanders. he's got to go into super tuesday in states he doesn't have any natural cob consistency. and then you add insult to injury, he's waiting to go back to the industrial northeast. when you find out major supporters have been young people, they're all on spring break. they are. they're going to be on spring break in michigan, ohio, pennsylvania. >> they may go home early. you never know. >> i doubt that. >> let me tell you the three things sanders has got to improve on, first of all he's got to get raid of that canned
speech. >> amen. >> he's got -- he's got a great skoir to tell. he should be telling those old civil rights stories and letting people see into his heart. every black voter's seen that speech. tell some stories. number two, he keeps letting hillary clinton get away with hugging the president. hillary clinton is on board with the president when it comes to foreign policy, the syria flyover zone. she's against him when it comes to trade. against the tpp. the cadillac tax. but she never raises those issues. she loves rahm emanuel -- >> also on the republican side we keep saying that donald trump is able to define his opponents -- >> that's exactly what -- >> hillary is defining him as a white issue candidate. >> that's my -- >> i was saying what you were saying to bakari, shut up, van.
>> but listen to me now. that's exactly where i was trying to go. the last thing he's doing, he has never defined his relationship with the president. >> she's defining it. >> he can say hillary loves the president. she's trying to defend his gains. i love the president. i'm trying to extend his gains. and define himself. >> bakari, don't let van suck up all the air in the room here. >> i'm trying. i'm raising my hand here. listen, to go to this idea about pandering is just nonsense. it's asinine to say that she's pandering. i mean, the black lives movement -- >> i remember once even on this broadcast van jones said the same thing. that was his criticism of hillary clinton. did you not say that, van? >> pandering. but go ahead. >> what i was saying was that the black lives matter movement, whether or not you like it or not, has brought many issues to the forefront. one of those issues is criminal justice reform.
flint michigan and all those kids dying. and understanding you have flints all over the country and talking about environmental justice, that's not pandering. finally talking about issues that affect the black vote in south carolina and the rest of the country, that ain't pandering. >> i want bob to get in here. >> what i was going to say, the idea of hugging barack obama close, where better to do it than south carolina and super discuss? he's got an unbelievable favor blilt rate. the problem he's got is he doesn't have anything to separate, she did this with obama and i was with him. i've never bought this motion that barack obama was going to be an albatross around her neck either in the primaries or the general election. i would hug him close too. why bernie isn't i don't know. >> stay with cnn for all of the politics events tomorrow night.
hillary clinton and bernie sanders takes questions from democrati moderated by chris cuomo. thursday night the gop presidential debate in houston moderated by wolf blitz er beginning at 8:30 eastern. when we come right back, what hpz if hillary clinton and donald trump go head to head? plus growing calls for police to boycott beyonce's world tour. why are some officers so angry at the superstar? ♪ i'm so possessive at's not protocol marsha. in by noon, out by 5 the next day. staples. make more happen.
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so a lot of things have happened since june 16th, when i announced i was running who knew this was going to happen? i figured maybe we would be in the middle of the pack by this time but we were going to edge it out at the end, you know, like a race horse. we edge it out, we win in the end. but we have a big lead and we don't want to blow it. but you know, frankly, we're going to go all the way. we're going to make america great again. >> that is donald trump speaking at a campaign rally in las vegas. let's listen in a little bit
more. >> we're going to make it better than ever before. you know, the fact is that over the last six months, seven months, i've been going around and every crowd it's like this every time. the people are amazing, and i've been saying that, the people are amazing. make america great again, it's going to be better than ever before. because our people in this country are incredible. now, it started on june 16th and i came down and i talked about illegal immigration. in fact, we have sheriff joe. where is sheriff joe? i love sheriff joe. i'll tell you what. there he is right there. when sheriff joe endorses trump that means there is nobody like trump on immigration, that, we know. >> all right, again, donald trump speaking live in las vegas. we'll continue to monitor that for you. speaking of donald trump, his victory in south carolina and the primary there has given him
a big lead in the race for delegates. let's talk about that. jeff dewitt, a trump surrogate, how is the atmosphere here? >> the atmosphere is great, if this is not true as you look around this room this is a movement. this is not a normal candidacy. there are over 12,000 people here who are beyond enthused who has the leadership, the courage, the will to make america great again. to see this, to see the energy in this crowd and what is going on here it really shows that something powerful is happening in america. >> let's look at the delegates, it's still early, he still has 68% pledged delegates so far.
he needs 3700 to win. but after winning in south carolina and new hampshire do you think he is going to run the table here? >> you know, i -- it certainly looks like we could absolutely run the table here, you know, we just picked up an extra delegate today in new hampshire. took all 50 in south carolina. and that was not a winner take all state. and we still took all 50 delegates. there is the potential to run the table. we'll see -- i think there is going to be enormous pressure on ted cruz and marco rubio and john kasich when they don't win their own states. if he doesn't win texas i don't know how he can expect to win the presidency. likewise, if marco rubio doesn't win florida i don't know how he can expect to win the presidency. so there will be enormous pressure on the candidates inca >> okay, here is what the
sceptics point out he never won as much as a third of the votes. he could lose to a candidate to consolidates the votes. is that something that the campaign is worried about? >> you said everyone else won a third, but you would think they will get more, mr. trump will get stronger, too. so if you look at a candidate like ted cruz if you were to drop out a lot of those people would go to mr. trump. when you look at ben carson, i can see a single scenario where almost every single ben carson voter -- without winning the entire vote. i won my race for state treasurer with 35% of the vote, my opponents had 22 and 33% respectively. so you never know what can happen. mr. trump will go higher as well. >> jeff, i want to let you get back to the rally. there are reports that rudy
giuliani has been in touch with donald trump and is advising him in some fashion. can you share information how donald trump may be changing his approach as it looks more and more like he is going to be the nominee? what kind of advice and input does he need and what is rudy giuliani giving him? >> you know, the best way i can say it, is that mr. trump is a businessman and brings people together. he is a great guy. he will listen to anybody that wants to call. rudy giuliani obviously, he is a great guy. >> so he has been in touch with rudy giuliani? >> well, yeah, i think it's been well reported, yeah, that he has been in touch with rudy giuliani. now, the aspects of that, that is between the two of them. he brings people together, it's great to hear that people like that are coming on board. everybody is getting on board as they realize what donald trump is bringing to america is something very powerful and everybody wants to be a part of it. >> jeff dewitt, thank you, sir,
i appreciate you coming on. >> any time. >> i want to bring in bakari sellers, and bob bechtel. you have heard donald trump and jeff dewitt, in las vegas, hayliegh, what do you think, is donald trump going to run the table? >> i think he will run the table to the point of possibly winning every state from here on out. cruz is ahead by five points in texas, cruz may win there, but donald trump is ahead in florida, rubio is a viable challenge but i think he will win there. you look at next tuesday, in the sec primary he is we'rie i winn of the states. one last point, the polls showed
many were angry with the federal government, that is what is girding his candidacy, that anger. >> i know you guys are democrats, but i still want to ask bob and bakari, do you think he could run the table? bakari, you first? >> i think he could run the table in the republican primary. donald trump did something amazing there in south carolina, not only did he beat the establishment in south carolina but he also beat the establishment that they want the republican to look like. he beat them down and won over evangelicals. and won over evangelicals. so yes, i think he can run the table. but on the flip side the republican primary in south carolina was 96% white. and me and kayleigh, you can't win with white conservatives, you simply can't, you have to grow and expand your party. >> bob, will he run for the
table explosive. >> no, he wouldn't win the table, all right keep it in perspective. he lost one, when christie jumps out of the race, trump's numbers in south carolina were higher and then when he came in, they were lower than expected. he didn't pick up christie or fiorina votes. i don't buy to trump inherits the voters. i think he has a ceiling into bob bechtel is a genius. donald trump is the frontrunner, there is no doubt about it. trump is doing an amazing job, stunned everybody, surprised me from the get go. but i do think he has a ceiling. and look, of course, if john kasich got out tomorrow, of course some votes would go to donald trump. the vast majority would not. and i think if you look at the people likely to get out in the near future, they will go to
marco rubio or ted cruz, they will not mostly go to donald trump. i don't think he can get over 50%, so the question is, now, will there be five candidates running in definitely or could you ever get trump one-on-one? until that happens or unless they employ my devious strategy of sort of jiu-jitsu, i don't think they can stop him. >> okay, before we move on, again, we're listening to donald trump there live in las vegas at a campaign rally, we're talking about him being the frontrunner. can he run the table? i'll give the final thoughts to kayleigh. >> yes, i would argue that iowa was a huge win, to bakari's point i would argue that polling shows he does the best of minorities among any republican candidate. frank luntz said he could do
better than any. >> he is taking heat for comments he made earlier about female supporters in his political career back in the '70s. this is a quote. he said they left their kitchens to get out and support him. he apologized today in an interview with wolf blitzer. >> sure, i'm sorry, anybody who is offended, of course. look, it's not -- of course, i'm more than happy to say i'm sorry if i offended somebody out there but it was not intended to be offensive and if you hear the whole thing you understand the context of it. >> does he get a pass on this? bakari? >> yeah, i mean, i think he does. listen, john kasich has run one of the more admirable campaigns of anybody in the circuit on the republican side. i don't think he was being sexist, he made a flippant remark, it was offensive.
i am sure a lot of people will make a lot out of this, i can't hold it against him, i think he did have some apology there. >> i don't think if he has to apology for anything -- look, he said when he ran for congress in the '70s, stay-at-home moms came out and voted for him. i think that is why donald trump -- >> he said women came out of the kitchen to put up yard signs for him. >> was it true? >> the theory they were not working women, the theory that they were second class citizens is not true. >> i don't think he suggested that. there probably were stay at home moms who came out of the kitchen and volunteered for him. look, if that is factually true in the '70s, why would he apologize for it? >> you're reaching back 40 years on a john kasich quote, and
donald trump makes more outrageous quotes and we don't go back and analyze those. >> he said that is why he believes that donald trump is win ining, he is not politicall correct into listen, to matt's point, if you look at the '70s, my mom was a working mom from the '60s on up. if you look at the '60s, if women did come out of their homes as mothers who were in the home, then what is wrong with what he said? bob? >> it's absurd, offensive. >> it may be offensive, but you have to put it in the context of the times, back then most women were stay at home moms and a lot of people came out to help john kasich in that race. i was involved in politics at that time. that is not the point. we're sitting here spending minutes on john kasich who is not going to be the republican nominee and we're letting donald trump pass on oh, did i look at
the transcripts? >> i would just reiterate, this is why people like donald trump are winning because somebody like john kasich, the media forces him to apologize for something that is not offensive. this is political -- people are fed up with it. >> but matt, this is also the reason that the republican party cannot win the presidency of the united states. because fundamentally they don't know how to talk to people. >> not true, not true. >> they don't know what is offensive and not offensive. >> because this dialogue -- >> it's your party that sees the world through the perviews of gender and race. there are some men who are stay at home dads who also work in the kitchen, if it is factually accurate, it is -- to matt's point. >> i can't believe we're having this discussion. donald trump has offended every segment of the population, i'll
tell you this to matt and kayleigh, continue to use this rhetoric and dialogue in the race, and in november you will have the president have a d by their name. >> there is nothing wrong with being a stay at home mom, that is probably the hardest job anybody can have, bakari? >> i'm not saying that, it is the way he used the phrase, to infer women were coming out of the kitchen, simply coming out of the kitchen and recelegating them to the second class -- >> how was it that i'm not offended, but bakari is offended on my behalf -- >> i want you to listen to what he said and then we can talk about it. here it is.
>> i went to washington following my mother's advice. i had been in the legislature before that at the age of 26. how did i get elected? i didn't have anybody for me. we just got an army of people who -- and many women who left their kitchens to go out and go door-to-door and put yard signs up for me all the way back when you know, things were different. now you call homes and everybody is out working but at that time early days it was an army of the women that really helped me to get elected to the state senate. >> so who has a problem with that? matt do you have a problem with that? >> no, i have a problem that he apologized. i think it shows he is a wimp. i think he is bound to political corre correctness. he didn't say anything wrong. this is 40 years ago, and stay at home moms helped him get elected. >> does that change anything listening to the context? >> no, in fact if you listen to the woman who asked the question next she said i want you to know
i will vote for you, but i won't be coming out of the kitchen to vote for you. i'm not sensitive, but if the person who is on this panel is supporting donald trump doesn't have a problem with it, please, consider to rhetoric on that side of the aisle. >> the fact that we're going on with john kasich about this and let donald trump get away with calling the only female candidate on the republican presidential plate ugly, calling megyn kelly basically a horrible issue about bleeding and then get away with it. >> we called him out owe. >> >> there is a controversy today, hillary clinton responded. this is something that happened on the campaign trail. john kasich can stand on his own words, can he not, without us talking about donald trump? >> did they spend that much time talking about donald trump when he said that fiorina was ugly? >> you criticized the media saying oh, my gosh, we're giving
too much attention -- which way do you want it, bob? >> i want attention paid to some of the worst rhetoric out of the worst presidential candidate i have ever heard. >> it's not affecting anybody yet. >> not yet, a long time to go, brother. >> all right, stay with cnn for all of this week's big political events tomorrow hillary clinton and bernie sanders take questions from the voters. and the town hall moderated by chris cuomo. thursday night the last debate in houston moderated by wolf blitzer. none other than wolf blitzer beginning at 8:30 eastern. up next, apple versus the fbi, should the company bow to pressure to unlock a terrorist phone? >> plus, why some police are coming for a boycott of beyonce's upcoming tour. first, let's listen to donald trump in las vegas. >> i don't even know what they're talking about, it's an ad, a cruz scam.
a court order which apple is refusing to comply with and saying they need to protect their customers. so who is right? here to discuss this is steven larsen, a former u.s. district judg judge. he is also representing victims, and also alan butler. good to have both of you here tonight. steven, we're starting with you. you worked with the victims' families and are filing a brief in support of the government. explain what apple is trying to do and why. >> at this point, the federal government is asking apple to follow the court order. the time has come for apple to provide access to the cell phone, and comply with the court order into and so allen, today, apple ceo tim cook sent out a memo. he said as individuals and a when they commit unspeakable
acts we work with authorities to pursue justice for the victims. that is exactly what we did. apple is a uniquely american company. it doesn't feel right to be on the opposite side of the government in the case representing the freedoms and liberties that government is meant to protect. you say apple is right to fight the fbi on this? why? >> well, to put it simply, the case is not just about this case. apple is looking forward to the future of other cases where they could be asking them to do the exact same thing. and apple realizes the significance of a precedent that would say that any government agency could order them to basically rewrite their software and make their devices less secure for everyone. >> steven, how do you respond to that? >> well, it's not true. there is no government organization that is ordering apple to do anything. it is a federal judge that is ordering apple to do this.
you can't hide criminal evidence. you can't put it in your house. you can't put it in your bank. you can't put it in your phone. and if you do that there is probable cause for the government to obtain the information, they can go to court and ask for the court to issue an order. that is what happened here. this is not a government agency, not a rogue entity within the government trying to track down and obtain information off the iphones. this is a federal judge sitting in riverside who has considered the application of the government, considered the government's arguments and has ordered apple to produce the information. >> i want to know, alan, what is the difference if there is probable cause for looking through your e-mails or personal documents or tax records, going through your home to do a search. why is this different? >> sure, well, the problem is that the fourth amendment establishes protectioningses but it doesn't grant the government authority.
so just because it says the government can do searches with probable cause doesn't mean that that evidence necessarily exists or that the government can access it. unlike a search of an e-mail account or a home that the government can enter, the fourth amendment doesn't guarantee them access to that information. >> he said we simply want the chance that the terrorists have to guess, without it taking a decade to guess correctly. that is it. we don't want to break anyone's encryption or set a key loose on the land. so apple is essentially saying we would love to help fight terror as much as the next person, but we will set this loose on the land and people will have their privacy invaded. >> if that was the case we
wouldn't talk babout it. i was a federal judge, civil rights attorney now i believe very strongly in these things. but at the same time we have compelling interests. that involves combatting this terrorist act. and finding out the information not only for the government but i want to be arguing for the victims, as well. they're entitled to this information. we are talking about a dead murderer terrorist who committed a horrible act using a cell phone that was actually owned by the county of san bernardino. this was not even his own cell phone. and to suggest that he has privacy rights at this point that trump the interest of law enforcement, given the procedures that have been followed here, given the fact that we've gone to a federal judge. given the fact that the fbi has gone to a federal judge and laid out their case and obtained an order, this is not a man running around doing these terrible
things. it's not fair to the government or law enforcement and most importantly it's not fair to the victims. >> alan, how many other iphones are locked in criminal cases? how often does this come up? >> sure, we know there are 150 iphones locked sitting in the new york prosecutor's office right now that he already said on the record he would immediately seek a similar order if there was a precedent set in this case. and that is just in one state. it's not just iphones that are contained in prosecutor's office. this concerns iphones stolen or lost or misplaced. this is a technique not only used by law enforcement but other people who want to hack these phones, as well. >> all right, alan and steven, great conversation, we know it will continue, there is a lot more. and coming up, why some are threatening to boycott beyonce's tour in the wake of her performance. who is right and who is wrong?
video and super bowl performance. joining me is the cnn contributor, bakari sellers, and could have of ebony magazine. it's good to have all of you here. let's go. some police groups are calling for a boycott of beyonce's upcoming tour, some of the boycott surrounding the events. are you surprised how deep the opposition of her performance is running? >> i am surprised, i thought on the show, what the heck, this is so silly, why are we having this conversation? because essentially i feel that beyonce like so many african-americans would absolutely never advocate violence against police. she is having a moment where she is connecting her art to a vibration to african-americans are on. we are standing together. young people are saying that it is not okay for police to be
violent. remember that the advent of the black panthers happens only because of the police. that is the irony here, you get the black panthers in proportion to police violence. it was the black panther party for defense. >> some say her performance is anti-police with the reference to the black panthers and black lives matter movement. do you feel it was anti-police? >> well, it's also racist. you know, her support of the black liberation army who, by the way, has assassinated over 15 police officers through the years, all right, the fact that the head of the bla, former head, malik shabbaz, called for the killing of whites and their families. so dressing up her dancers like the bla definitely tells me it was a racist statement and shows
support for an organization that has murdered and assassinated police for years. >> i was just so encouraged that so many black people watched and all americans watched that pbs documentary because there is a misinformation campaign that has long existed in relationship to the black panthers. and it's high time we talk about the truth and begin to analyze the correct history. there is not one narrative about the black panthers. the police don't get to tell what the black panthers are. we get to define what they were for us. >> what did the dead police officer s. >> what about all the dead police officers? >> i have to laugh at harry for him saying it was racist, i have to laugh at him for saying it was racist because it's not. i wish harry and others were as vocal when we have young african-american men who die at the hands of police officers who die at the hands of police for crimes they should not be sentenced to death for.
we all agree, harry, that police officers go out every day and they serve and protect and do so with such honor. however, there is a very, very specific pain that is felt by african-americans that beyonce and kendrick lamar are speaking to right now. >> why are the very few instances that occur why police officer s are involved in some kind of misconduct or maybe even murdered, those police offices s are sent to court and they're arrested and they are convicted. all right? >> no, they're not. >> why are those few instances -- >> they're not, though. >> you tell me which cases. you tell me which cases, bakari. >> we can go down the line. we can go down the line here. >> one at a time, police. >> we can talk about what happened in ferguson was murder, i'm sorry, it was not. okay, what happened in staten island was murder, i'm sorry, it was not. what happened in carolina --
yes, i agree o-- >> we can go back to 1968, where you had them fire into a group of students at south carolina state. we can talk about that, harry, we can talk about the fact that we have people -- >> why don't they talk about all the people that go without finding justice. >> why don't you talk about the real issues, though? >> black on black crime? >> exactly, that is the real issue. the chance is 70 -- 70 times more -- >> black life sir -- >> killed by another black. >> harry, here is another thing. i don't think that anyone here will not say there is not an issue of people killing each other -- >> apparently it's not an issue. >> you can talk about people being shot or abused by police officers and you can also talk about on the other hand, people who are killing each other on the streets. i want to get in the show here. law enforcement feels that
beyonce in the show is promoting division between law enforcement and african-american communities. i talked with a former mayor of new york city, rudy giuliani. we talked about it a week ago. >> maybe it wouldn't be a bad idea for people who have the kind of fame and celebrity that she has to teach everybody in her community and people in every other community to respect the police. to respect the uniform. not to make it appear as if they're the enemy. but to respect the uniform of our police officers. of our military. that is the way i was brought up. that is a lot safer way to bring up your child, by the way. >> michelle, this is what you do every day. you speak to artists in the entertainment industry and beyond. so what exactly is the responsibility of an artist like beyonce and in the community, you would know, saying the responsibility of a person, someone like beyonce. >> first of ago, it's the way i was brought up as well, i would
say to mr. rudy giuliani. it is also the way that beyonce was brought up, to respect the police. i'm quite sure that she does. i think what is really interesting here is when did the conversation go from you know, beyonce making a statement in her art to she hates the police? i mean, i really don't even see the correlation there. i think it is really interesting when these people here, the majority -- >> because you don't want to see it. >> harry, let me finish, i listened to you, i would appreciate the same to me. but what i was saying is i think it's very interesting that these people i consider everyday heroes, the majority of them, and i'm speaking about the police now are saying because we're mad at you we are not going to, or we potentially don't want to do for you what we signed up to do. and that is serve and protect. i don't know, this is america, and we're allowed to have a voice and freedom of speech and if you don't want to serve and
protect someone that you may not agree with, i'm not sure why you sign up to be a police officer. that is my view on this. >> we have to clear this up, don, the one issue here is not the fact that police officers don't want to protect her. >> that is what they said. >> these are side jobs that the police officers get paid extra. they get paid extra to go out and this is volunteer work to wear the uniform and protect somebody like beyonce, protect the venue. this is not working while you're a member of the police department. you're just wearing the uniform. this is a side job, these are the jobs the police officers are talking about that they want to boycott. >> but they're also protecting the people who go to the show as regular citizens, as well. >> this is a side job, they do not have to do this. all right, but if police officers are assigned through the police department to go and work at a concert those officers have to do that. >> okay, as i was saying earlier an added layer on top of this,
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. i'm back with harry howe, bakari turner. and louis farrakhan gave a speech today and praised beyonce for taking a stand. >> sweet sister beyonce. now, you know, people are terrified. beyonce? rudy giuliani said, on the greatest platform in the world. the super bowl. he started talking that black stuff. and white folks, said we don't know how to deal with that. but when one of us shows some
independence, look at how you are treating beyonce now. you going to picket? you're not going to offer her police protection? i will. >> i'm going to let you handle that, bakari. >> oh, you come to me first. you know, my answer to this is i'm still not sure how we got to this point. >> exactly. >> i'm still not sure -- i am at a loss on how we got from seaze to 100 in the words of the great american poet, drake, so quickly. i find myself -- >> really, bakari. >> i found myself standing very proudly with beyonce and kendrick lamar, not just because they're millennials and a part of our generation, again, they're articulating the pain
going on in our cities. and he is less than ten miles away from where walter scott was killed, and eight others were gunned down. we'll take a deep breath. >> i was there. >> you don't feel the pain i feel. >> so harry, listening to that -- >> what about the pain that i feel with the police officers that were murdered by the bla? >> when you hear minister farrakhan saying the police wouldn't do it, i'll do it. >> first of all, i don't listen to what mr. farrakhan says, he is a racist. i wouldn't give this guy 30 seconds of my time in my life. >> revisionist history of the black panthers. i have to keep coming back to that. it's not okay to simply discount the counterintelligence program
-- >> what is your version of it? >> i encourage the viewers to watch the counterintelligence program, to learn about the black panthers for themselves. when you fact find about this organization it's not about a single narrative or a bunch of crazed cop killers. that is a lie. and it's important that we say this. >> what is a lie? that they didn't kill cops? >> did the cops kill mark clark and fred hampton? >> they assassinated police officers, the fbi was watching them because they were a group of criminals. okay? >> you don't get to kill unarmed people or kill people who are asleep because -- >> police officers can kill unarmed persons -- >> very clear about the fact that the counterintelligence program violated civil rights. you have to do the research. i bet you, harry, yourself are
uninformed about the truth of black panthers. again, this narrative. >> no, i'm not, i've seen, i went after the black panthers and went after joanne chezamord. >> unfortunately. >> the fact that we're having such an intense conversation right now and people are saying i don't understand how we got here in the words of the great poet, drake, as bakari says, as someone who is in the media. you and i are trained in the media, we do it every day. i understand how we got here. there is a division, i've been watching the people versus o.j. simpson. the divisions about race in this country are so deep. you have one side who are really upset and feel that police officers are not getting their fair shake. and you have people of color who have a different reality, it may not just be white, but police officers. then you have someone as controversial as minister louis
farrakhan coming aboard then things get much worse. talk about racial division, this is what is going on -- i want her to respond, go ahead. >> i think you're right. that is when it comes combustible when you get the polarizing figures on every side all coming together and spouting whatever rhetoric or feelings they have. that is when it becomes combustible. i still go back, we live in america, the greatest country in the world. we have the right to express ourselves. beyonce is an artist. i think that the song is a brilliant song. she calls it a song of empowerment and of self love. she certainly has never called it a song, anti-police song. she never called the video one anti-police. there is a scene in this where you have a young boy who is crunking the front of the police line. you see the words, stop shooting
us. i am not even sure where the words that say stop shooting us turns into police hate. i think there is a lot of agreement on both sides. the air is thick right now. these conversations need to be had had sometimes really at the root and being raw in order to take a step forward. >> harry -- >> harry, we will continue this conversation -- >> and hopefully one day you will understand. >> we'll talk about this more. >> and i hope you will understand it also. >> i mean. >> thank you, everybody. i want you to stay with maye, u next we'll talk about hollywood's big night. but will it be overshadowed by a controversy?
. should be oscar so controversy, the academy awards are this weekend and this year's show may just be the most controversial in years in the wake of the outrage over the all-white nominations. but the diversity in tinseltown may be worse than ever. worse than you think, because there was a new study released finding across the board, women
in hollywood, minorities, hugely under-represented. this backs up what people are saying about this controversy but then goes even further into this. >> well, you know, it's not the first time we've heard these numbers and seen one of those studies. it seems like they do come out. the numbers are pretty much consistent. they did use very, very inflammatory words, things like whitewash saying that the major media companies are white-washed. they also used a phrase like an epidemic of invisibirity. and what it did was lend to the argument the real hard factual number that is people really can't argue with when you want to have the debate. so the numbers are in front of you, the study is in front of you and it does lend to you the
argument being had on the conversations being had. >> go ahead. >> i just read this in the times on my way here. of the 30 films that a black person received a nod for best actor or best actress, only three directed by a black man, action by a woman. so that really does speak to this continuing problem of representation. >> that is one of the studies said, we have more of an inclusion problem than anything. >> right. >> yeah, and i think it's interesting, too, because it spoke to you know women and minorities but also the most underrepresented group was the lgbt community. there were 2% of all characters on television define themselves as lgbt. >> i also think for the asian-american community it's pretty dire. >> yes, absolutely, absolutely.
>> i'll see you at the end of the week. >> oh, i cannot wait. >> chris rock is going to be like kendrick lamar. he will have his moment. >> make sure you stay tuned, 6 p.m. eastern, isha sesay and i will wrap it up. that is it for us tonight. thank you for joining us. don't miss cnn south carolina democratic town hall followed by live coverage and the nevada caucuses beginning at 10:00. . . . .
ted cruz fires a top campaign aide for circulating a big lie. donald trump unleashes a level of attacks. tonight, hillary clinton and bernie sanders on stage in south carolina. they will face the voters in a cnn town hall. they each have new strategies in play to win votes before south carolina. and uber driver admits to having a role in a deadly shooting spree while he was working. why police are calling his rampage baffling. welc t