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tv   Anderson Cooper 360  CNN  April 20, 2016 9:00pm-10:01pm PDT

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that's it for us tonight. i'll see you right back here tomorrow night. "ac 360" starts right now. good evening. big campaign developments all across the map tonight. donald trump, hillary clinton holding events this evening, both going on right now. trump's back on the war path after striking a more presidential or diplomatic tone in the wake of his big win last night. he and secretary clinton trying to turn their crushing victories into success next week in pennsylvania, maryland. trying to work around it or work the system so they can prevail at the conventions even though they're behind in delegates right now.
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we'll talk about all that in the next two hours of live coverage tonight. we will talk about all that, including the possibly he needs may be lower than the 1237 we have been talking about all of that is out of windows, he has gone back to the rally in
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maryland. at one point during the remarks, he said he will investigate hillary clinton's e-mail practices, dishing out the red meat at this rally. earlier at his event in indianapolis. here is a bit of that. >> one of the reasons that a vote far beyond what polls said, i wasn't surprised. when you look, the vote was incredible. it was record-setting in the case of lying ted. lies, he lies. you know ted, he brings the bible, puts the bible down, lies, bernie is gone. you know that? don't you? i loved running against crooked hillary. better.
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better. bernie wouldn't be as much fun. so, you heard much of that at the event in maryland. as for why donald trump once they are gone, so go their nicknames. >> you should point out, donald trump's top officials. again, they are saying the
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system is rigged. and the candidates, they are saying, they they believe the party establishment is scared. the people scare the hell out of him. >> hillary clinton is speaking, we will bring you a live report in a few moments, now, the panel. . >> the super delegates committed to her, switch? >> first off, she has to reach the magic number of 2383.
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within the margins, even with new york in consideration, he picked up two dozen, about fourlt delegates right now in new york. so, this is her home state, she won by a smaller margin than in 2008. it will be a tough fight. a closed primary, wasn't friendly to bernie sanders. we are all aware of that it they are not supposed to declare until they are on the convention floor. all unified. turned this idea of challenging money and status quo, i think we have to start paying attention to that as the numbers get closer in the next several races, there are aren't as many close primaries like new york. 40% of them are soft. many voting against their own districts, and the turn-outs in their sdktds.
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>> it sounds like you are making verbal gymnastics. i lost you half way through. it is a lot of qualified phrases and things that honestly i lost you about halfway through. >> that's tough. right? >> she's getting the votes, has the most delegates, and in order for him to get enough delegates, mathematically it is virtually impossible. >> she has been capped at 250. that delegate count hasn't gone up. won 7 of the 8 races except new york, that's why. >> talking about next week? >> i think so, none of them as closed as new york. new york is home territory. was designed for her, had every endorsement in the world. including herself. # >> which i am extremely proud of. but we want new york, clinton that is, very big, 60, 40, in a state that sanders campaign said was a must win. true, well documented.
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now yesterday the spin was well, if she wins only by single digits it is a loss. today the spin is it is a closed primary, we are independent. >> who is saying that. >> that has always been the process in new york. we won significantly. and if you look at the math, math isn't that complicated. the math is against senator sanders. it is basically mathematically impossible for him to get where he needs to go. >> let's turn to the republican side, we are going to go to secretary clinton shortly to hear her. caylee, donald trump, path forward after last night, you have to be confident? >> absolutely, when you connect pennsylvania, rhode island, he is leading in most states by 20 points, we could see a margin of victory translate into four to five states next week, this discussion of a second ballot, which by the way hasn't happened since 1948, discussion of second ballot and nomination being
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taken is all for nil, all academic. i think donald trump will win outright. >> tara, do you think he has a chance to get enough delegates before? >> it is possible but difficult. he needs to win 63% of delegates left on the table. he only won 48% until now. so that said, that's assuming we will give him next tuesday, baked into the cake. expect donald trump to do well there. when you get into the may contests, donald trump is not doing as well. he may only come out the whole month of may with 20 delegates between washington state, oregon, montana. those places, he is not well organized at all. ted cruz is. so may, everyone is excited now, but you get to may, he may be only at 950. >> do you think organization continues to be a problem? >> absolutely. ted cruz outorganized donald trump when it comes to this sort of retail politics, to courting delegates.
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cruz dominates. but donald trump dominates when it comes to giving big speeches and winning open primaries especially. but you know, you can't take new york away from him. i think the problem cruz has is the problem republicans and nontrump republicans had this entire cycle is there's never been a clear alternative to rise up against donald trump. we thought coming out of wisconsin it would be ted cruz. gets zero delegates in new york. >> for all of the talk of look, if donald trump gets close enough to 1237, they have to give it to him, and the rnc, paul ryan are saying the rules are the rules. has to be 1237. >> has to be a majority. >> if it goes to second ballot, ted cruz has a shot. >> not just what ted cruz is banking on, relying on after last night's results. last night's results made it impossible for ted cruz to get the nomination before the convention.
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and i think it is true, we know ted cruz is well organized, not just in some of the more rural states, more conservative states but also more importantly in making sure that the delegates that are awarded when they get to that point of the process in these states, that the cruz people bring them their way. but that is changing, it really is. the trump campaign, there's a dramatic shift, maybe not so much, we saw him, the way we saw him on the stump today, sounded like the old donald trump who threw red meat to his supporters, but the internal workings of the trump campaign is just night and day. >> a lot of people are saying the worst thing that happened to stop trump or never trump movement is they did too good a job of demonizing cory lewandowski, the campaign manager. people coming in that know how to run it. >> good example of that, i don't truthfully, nothing against the
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trump people, they hadn't done it before, i don't get the sense they wrapped their heads around the unbound delegates, many of them in pennsylvania next week. 54 unbound, which means doesn't matter how the voters vote, they can go for whomever they want when they get to the convention floor. those are people that the trump camp are working really, really hard now, and others like them in various states with the same process, that's something that wasn't happening two, three weeks ago. >> trump has another thing going for him, the fact that cruz is showing so much weakness now in states with more liberal and moderate electorates. do you want to nominate cruz, knowing he had fewer votes, it will blow up the convention, people will do crazy stuff, even though the evidence is stronger and stronger that he is not a strong general election candidate either.
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it is not like you have somebody to replace trump with, most republican insiders think has a shot at beating hillary clinton. weakness he shows outside his core areas of strength, evangelical and tea party voters, makes it harder to justify giving it to him on second ballot. >> there is an unknown factor with donald trump, don't know what direction he is going or attack he makes. in general election, no telling how tough he can be against hillary clinton. all the pundits are saying it would be great to have hillary clinton if she's the nominee running against him or bernie sanders running against him. he has shown himself far more resilient than anyone predicted. >> absolutely. that's why people like hillary clinton say don't discount donald trump. this is a challenge looking forward to general election. and donald trump, yes, sporadic, sometimes don't know what's coming. the good thing is we know he is not a mitt romney who didn't attack. many republicans didn't think he attacked obama enough.
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he is not going to be a mccain. he will bring in e-mails, benghazi. hillary clinton will have to answer hard questions alongside donald trump. >> just ahead, more on the two frontrunners and challenges. how each can triumph or stumble. what happens if donald trump comes close but falls short of delegates. we will take you to houston where flooding has taken 8 lives, done billions in damage, more water is on the way.
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looking live at the hillary clinton event in philadelphia. bernie sanders went home to vermont to regroup from last night's defeat, he will be stumping in pennsylvania tomorrow. joe johns is at the clinton rally. hillary clinton just finished speaking. what was her approach today, what does she have to say? >> reporter: hello, anderson. she has just finished speaking, just wrapped up here in philadelphia. healthy size crowd. she pushed hard here talking about her connection to pennsylvania, the fact that her father is from scranton, pennsylvania. she says she was baptized in pennsylvania, her brother lived here, of course. she talked a little about the fact that the philadelphia
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democratic convention is coming up, it is here for people in the audience tonight, talked a lot about the clinton years, the booming economy in the 1990s, blamed the change in the economy on republican president george w. bush. focused a lot on the republicans, including those running for president now. one interesting note, i think this also happened at an earlier rally with hillary clinton here in this city, a small group of african-american protesters appeared to be black lives matter protesters were removed from the audience. i could hear the chanting, it didn't much disrupt the crowd. crowd noise was very loud,
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didn't seem to affect the candidate. perhaps some pictures we can show you. she wrapped up here in philadelphia, this obviously is a big push for her in the state. bernie sanders as well. he is going to be at three stops in pennsylvania tomorrow, anderson. >> joe, thanks very much. with his victory last night, donald trump, is he the only one capable of get to go 1237? everyone is is mathematically eliminated. and on the other side, bernie sanders faces longer odds. that said, the political road has plenty of twists and turns. may come up with donald trump short. joining us, chief national correspondent, john king. >> donald trump, a difficult path to get to 1237 before the republican convention, not impossible, and not impossible to get close and cut deals with remaining delegates. why not impossible? plus 90 last night. that gives trump a huge boost. he leads in all five states next week, maybe add another 100 delegates.
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gets him to 950. project it out to the end. trump will win new jersey, west virginia, give cruz the west, give this scenario, give cruz this scenario, see if that happens. then get to california, trump wins california. you could see him with a big win in california, around 1200, close to 1200. if he can go into indiana, upset ted cruz that, he can get up to 1223, maybe higher. more likely back here. if trump runs the board, competitive in indiana, big night in california, 1237 is hard. see him getting 1200, 1220 range, not impossible at all. his campaign thinks if they get there, even above 1175, cut deals with nonpledged, noncommitted delegates after june 7 and by cleveland have 1237. next week is critical, indiana first week of may will tell us more about donald trump's prospects of getting closer. now the democratic side, hard
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for hillary clinton to pull away as donald trump has. she believes the math is near impossible after the win in new york. she believes next tuesday she will win four of five. on track to win pennsylvania, maryland, delaware big. hillary clinton hoping to stretch her lead to the point in terms of pledge delegate math almost impossible, that bernie sanders would need 75 or 80% of remaining pledge delegates to catch up. last night was huge for hillary clinton. next tuesday, the exclamation point she wants. she believes it will play out like this after that, be bernie sanders with a couple wins. hillary clinton gets close to 2200 by end of the process, that scenario she needs superdelegates to put her over the top. can hillary clinton win with just pledge delegates? possible, but unlikely. can she stretch it out, keep winning to keep 500 superdelegates in her back pocket, that and the strategy
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and the primary here, get to convention with support of establishment, get over the top. bernie sanders to change the math, last night was a big chance, he missed it. next tuesday is critical. >> john, thanks very much. back with our panel. how much do you expect bernie sanders and secretary clinton to stop battling each other. secretary clinton would like to be focusing on donald trump on the gop. >> you know, i don't know the answer to that truthfully. if you would have asked me how much they're going to stop battling after the last big hillary clinton win, i would say they'll probably take it down a notch. i know this from reporting that people inside the hillary clinton campaign wanted that to happen, but for various reasons as always happens in campaigns, things spun out of control and it got incredibly hot between them. however, i think at this point they both see not just hillary clinton but bernie sanders, both
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see that they don't have a lot to gain by really being as scrappy as they were, obviously in particular hillary clinton because as she said explicitly, she wants to unite the party, get people behind her. for bernie sanders, he says he is running for real, and you believe him, but he is very much a message candidate and has a lot to gain at the convention and beyond by beginning to play nice, to try to get his message into some of the policy platforms of the party. >> certainly has the money, has done amazingly well. continues to. >> i think it is interesting, what degree can he bind hillary clinton so she is not able to move back to center. she has been substantially to the left, far to the left of where her husband was or where she was as u.s. senator. the fear of bernie sanders
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people is once she is in general election, then if she wins, she will put the same old wall street in top positions in the treasury department, start to cut free trade deals again, won't let campaign finance reform priority. for them, although it is painful to look at it this way, a lot of it has to do with how to convert support you have into leverage into what kind of president she would be. >> there are several movements from black lives matter, it is a coalition of blue collar workers, valuable for the democratic race that trump has a strong hold on. it is a movement of movements that are unifying against the root cause of the problems that we see in america, which is campaign finance. when hillary clinton is accepting wall street money, it
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is hard for them to see how she can change that strategy moving forward if elected president. one more thing we are not taking into consideration, the way the democratic party changed in the past 30 years. after mcgovern, a lot of reform was made, then they reversed reforms. there was a coup by more conservative democrats, possibly because the country was more conservative then, they started to bring in money and brought in candidates based on viability of fund-raising, rather than leadership and how they organize communities. grass roots democrats are turned
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off by that type of democratic party. >> christine do you believe this is a movement of movements? >> i think this has been one of the probably most dynamic and robust primaries we have seen. you have to give absolutely senator sanders and his campaign tremendous amount of credit for amplifying issues that needed to be amplified. when secretary clinton said it is time to unify the party, i think she's right. what that means is to union guy in a strong way around issues that have become front and center, income inequality, police misconduct. more affordable housing for people at every level, homeless, moderate, middle income americans.
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real job creation with jobs people can live on, pay rent on. the real choice now for all of us as democrats is to say and the longer the struggle goes on in a way that's divisive, less likely it is. >> i want to add to what you said, peter, no question that the clinton campaign has been moved left on a lot of issues but some issues if she goes against donald trump could help her because it is so scrambled now when you look at populism. >> bernie sanders can be a difficult person because his conditions don't go strictly to the conservative line, supportive of planned parenthood other than abortion service. >> take trade, for example, if she were to do what some of the bernie sanders people fear she would do, say she's against free trade now and then pivot to she and the wing of the party, where her husband was, but if she's up against donald trump, she's less likely to do that. >> we have to take a short break. we are monitoring a protest, donald trump finished speaking,
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we are monitoring a protest,
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we have seep the allegations that entire system is rigged by -- as we mentioned, the spring meeting opened today. two of three candidates. meeting to discuss changing convention rules. trump did not himself attend. we spoke a short time ago. >> shawn, the meeting, what was the take away.
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you need 1237 delegates to become the nominee. we have a ways to go in the race. each of the campaigns was here making their case. >> the idea that trump may not get to 1237 before the convention but close enough for supporters to claim moral victory, the party some would say would be on tricky ground in terms of optics to have someone else get the nomination in a second round of voting, is it just the rules are the rules, any number short of 1237 it has to go to another rounding voting? >> absolutely. it is 1237 or bust. look, anderson, for any conservative out there, remember obamacare when it was passed initially or up first, it was three votes christmas eve. no one said if it is close, it should pass. that's not how it works. when majority decides, majority decides.
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takes 1237 delegates to pass any order of business. we have to remember that. there's no other time we would say, whether politics or sports, if you get to the 2 yard line, that counts as a touchdown, that's just not how the rules work. i think then would be incumbent on the trump and other campaigns to make the case to delegates on the first round of voting, then on every subsequent number of votes to get to the majority. that's the process we have gone through dating back to 1856, alternately, majority of delegates decide every aspect of our convention. >> to the trump supporters that say look, if he's winning raw votes, winning overall by delegates by the time of the convention, isn't it more of a public relations mess, don't you run the risk of alienating those supporters? what do you say to them? >> look, i think anyone that remembers 2000, al gore won popular vote, george bush won the electoral college.
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didn't have people saying, al gore acknowledged that's how our democracy works. we have a constitution predicated on the electoral college. george bush won more electoral votes. i don't think anybody said at that time throw out the constitution, put al gore in office, we have a set of rules, whether the constitution or party rules. they dictate you need 1237 this cycle to become the nominee. i understand that people would be upset. my argument would be to say to them go out there, have your campaign, continue to organize, make the case to unbound delegates and to bound delegates to stick with you. that's frankly what a campaign is built on, organization. i would argue that all of the campaigns need to engage in that. >> sean, always good to have you on. thank you. >> thanks, anderson. for a brief moment after his victory in new york, donald trump seemed more presidential, ditching some of the insults. but he is back on the attacks. yes, i will see when 360 continues.
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last night donald trump only speak for eight minutes, unlike earlier victory speeches that went on longer, involved steak and other products. also called senator cruz and governor kasich. today he is back to calling him lying ted. fresh attacks 24 hours after he seemed to be dropping nicknames at the least, whether you say he was playing nice or calling his top opponent something he hasn't called him in a long time. more from tom foley. >> in the case of lying ted cruz, lying ted, lies, oh, he lies. >> reporter: so much for the change in tone. donald trump is back on the war path. >> i'm about 300 delegates ahead of lying ted. >> reporter: hammering home his nickname for his nearest challenger for the gop crown, senator ted cruz, it is the donald trump we've seen for months. >> i call him lying ted. remember lying ted cruz. lying ted. i'm donald trump, i approved this message. >> the politicians can pretend it is something else, but donald trump calls it radical islamic terrorism.
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>> from the beginning trump said he is just telling it like it is. he slammed marco rubio for his height and for sweating. >> you have this clown, marco rubio, i call him little marco. little marco. it's rubio. >> reporter: he ridiculed carly fiorina's looks, chris christie's relations with the white house, and mocked pretty much everything about jeb bush. >> this guy can't negotiate his way out of a paper bag. >> reporter: the list goes on. after his loss in wisconsin, some of his inner circle thought the scorching rhetoric may have played a part in his defeat. even his family said he should lighten up the attacks on his foes. >> said please, please, my wife, my daughter ivanka, daddy, please be more presidential. i said i have to take them out before i get presidential, don't i, right? >> reporter: still, looks like he took the advice for a little
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while, bringing in a teleprompter for more tempered remarks, and new advisers who seem to be slowing down his chain saw approach. as the new york results pushed his delegate count up, he grew more civil, calling cruz, gasp, senator. >> senator cruz is just about mathematically eliminated. you >> reporter: but by this afternoon he was once again savaging cruz and democratic frontrunner hillary clinton. >> i love running against crooked hillary. i would love that so much. you know ted, he brings the bible, puts it down, lies. >> reporter: from the business man in new york, business as usual. tom foreman, cnn, washington. >> back to our panel. last night you were saying donald trump you saw was one you would like to see more of. do you think he has abandoned it for good? are you disappointed? is this just the way he runs.
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>> not disappointed, we will see more of what we saw last night. the thing is it has to be a meaningful, understandable transition. he can't go from being someone who is organic, spontaneous, fun, lively, people like to watch to someone that's poll tested, focus group tested politician. that would be inauthentic. it would be like when marco rubio went from being the politician to doing a standup comedy act. the thing that has gotten donald trump, he is the guy that says something on the campaign trail, that he says at the dinner table. same guy with his family he is on stage. people like that, believe it, find it honest, trustworthy. for him to change and be a different person, it wouldn't be believable. >> tara, you look like you've gone to a special place. >> i sit here and listen to this, i think of all of the excuses trump supporters make for his disgusting, bigoted, sexist, misogynistic behavior,
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consistently, over the years, and try to put a pretty face on it. as a conservative and as a republican i think that character and integrity matters and donald trump has demonstrated time and time again he doesn't have the character or temperament to be president of the united states. this isn't running for school yard bully here. this is for president of the united states, you have real issues, you have to be thoughtful, you have to be able to exude some honesty, character, integrity. donald trump doesn't do that. he says he is a character. >> i think what we are seeing is a microcosm of the trump campaign that is actually experiencing an identity crisis now. you have the angel on his one shoulder, paul manafort telling him look, you know. >> i don't know about angel. >> i use the term loosely. being brash got you this far. if you want to get to the next level, you have to pivot like in rocky, he switches and quits
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fighting as a south paw to use a very old reference. what happens is when trump is in front of the audience and says these funny, controversial lines, he gets applause. that's the temptation. >> they have been trying to paint him as racist, bigoted, islamaphobic. they make him into a different thing every week. they poured $70 million into attacking donald trump, three times what donald trump spent on the entire campaign. instead of anyone believing those things, republican voters are saying we see through the act, through the facade and
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he called for temporary ban of >> non-u.s. citizens. >> if someone called for banning noncitizen jews from entering the united states, would you feel calling that president antisemite? >> if you have people with blonde hair, blue eyes. >> i didn't talk about that, we are talking about a religious group. it happens to matter a great deal to me. i would like to know the answer. islamaphobic, it would be if it was solely because of identity and religion. he proposes it not for that, but because there's a string within that islamic face that is radical islam, responsible for the death are the parisians, he recognizes there's a problem. until we figure out ow honot let them come in and shoot -- >> you haven't answered. there are terrorists of other faiths. if you respond to terrorism by jews or by christians which happens, by punishing all members of that religion to enter the united states, you would have no question -- >> if it was driven by disdain,
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for a religion, it would be. it is not that. it is a policy proposal to find out how malik got into the country. >> it is a practical and sensible policy position. there are billions of muslims of all different sects and faith, it is painting them all with a broad brush. there are muslims from countries you don't see this kind of terrorism. the percentage of people involved in this is tiny. isn't it painting with a broad brush shi'a, sunni, other sects. >> he said himself it is not all muslims. western europe had open borders, 400 isis fighters got into western europe. i don't want the united states of america become western europe, i have to worry about friends and family going to their innocent place of
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business. >> how do you identify who is muslim. >> do a temporary ban on all of them if worried about isolating -- >> doesn't it bother, i see you are wearing a cross. doesn't it bother you that pope francis has brought syrian muslims into the vatican? isn't that a better message than what donald trump said, we're going to penalize every muslim that's not american citizen because of the actions of a few. >> until we fix the problem. # and the fbi said we have no way to vet the refugees, of finding out who they are. none of it is driven by hate. >> that's not true. we go through, they have to be qualified through -- they're not coming on planes. there's home grown terrorism and it is fueled by this kind of rhetoric. if he is president, how does he deal with saudi arabia?
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>> the fbi director disagrees with you. >> i never said he supports donald trump's policy, but we have no way of vetting to find out who is a terrorist and who is not. >> we will continue with it. there's more rain on the way for houston, texas. we will come back to this subject. more with the panel ahead. the death toll from the flooding is rising. more rescues and stories of heroism next after a quick break.
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the houston is getting more of what it doesn't need, rain. homes, cars, hopes and dreams are now submerged in water. brief downpours are possible in the next couple days. more rivers and creeks could spill their banks, the death toll climbed higher. too early to tell when the area will be dry again. ed lavandera reports. >> reporter: she just finished the longest walk of her life, through waist high flooding to get the worst possible news, that her home is swamped in at least four feet of water. >> why did you want to walk there?
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>> the unknown. >> reporter: this is what the house looked like as she left it monday night and flood waters crept closer. she says the quiet creek near her house is a rolling river. she can't get close enough to see how bad the damage is. >> emotional few days. >> totally. there's a lot of memories at that house. we lost both our parents there, haven't been able to go through a lot of things. i know will be lost now. >> there's stuff, you can't replace it. >> reporter: a staggering week of flooding. 8 died, some trapped in cars or in fast moving water. officials say more than 240 billion gallons of rain have fallen on houston. that's enough to fill more than 360,000 olympic size pools. there was so much rain so fast, lives changed overnight.
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julie skoelton went to bed listening to heavy rainfall, woke up with four feet of water on the first floor. >> never thought we would wake up to four feet. we woke up, walked down the stairs, one of my tv stands was floating in front of the stairwell. that's when i told my husband we have to go. >> reporter: emergency teams worked around the clock to move people from flooded residential areas. these first responders got creative using a storage container to move kids to higher ground. several hundred thousand and crisscrossing the usually jammed roads of houston. neighborhoods on cypress creek have been hard hit for two days. sheriff's deputies found this woman and her family. >> it is terrible. it is our home.
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we left and i don't know when we'll be back. >> reporter: several inches of water started to flow into the home and they knew it was time to get out. >> it is hard. you just don't know what to pack up, what to do. we grabbed some things, the dog, the kids, leave it. >> ed lavandera joins us. >> reporter: it is a nice evening tonight, but more rain is expected tomorrow and on sunday. the best residents can do is wait for flood waters to recede. some officials say it will be several days. in the county, they say some areas could take as long as a month. >> ed, thanks very much. up next, a kind of dealing that donald trump may have to do to get delegates he needs. and wrangling in florida over changing rules at the convention. talk to a guy that's seen it up talk to a guy that's seen it up close for himself.
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good evening, welcome to the next phase of the presidential campaign that a lot of experts would be done weeks ago. new york mattered, and tonight, we are seeing the fallout. hillary clinton accelerating her level of the campaign, bernie sanders vowing to stay in until the end. ted cruz and john kasich going to florida, trying to turn a possible c