tv CNN Newsroom With Brooke Baldwin CNN May 20, 2016 11:00am-1:01pm PDT
some of the families overwhelmed because, one, there may be a language barrier, they don't understand what's happening there. so it's been a very, very difficult time. wolf? >> miguel, i'm sure it has been for everyone. our hearts go out to those families. thank you for joining us. that's it for me. the news continues next right here on cnn. ♪ here we go, top of the hour. you are watching cnn, i'm brooke baldwin. thank you for being with me. we begin with breaking news on flight ms804, a total of 6 of people, including three young children are presumed dead. at the moment, in the mediterranean sea egyptair crew says they are recovering body parts, finding pieces of the plane, debris, we're told aircraft seats, suit cases. the scene is grim. it's floating in waters roughly 180 miles north of alexander
rhea, egypt. the airbus a 320 bound for cairo went down just after entering egyptian air space during an otherwise routine flight. we do now have photos of the two men at the helm of the plane, the pilots, with more than 6,000 hours in the cockpit. the copilot had almost 3,000 hours. the egyptian government saying they have no evidence whatsoever to implicate either of them. and they are also standing by their belief that this plane was brought down by terror. but -- this is key -- we're going to get into this. without those black boxes, the flight data recorder, the voice recorder,' still impossible to know whether someone inside the cockpit steered the plane into sea, whether the plane was blown out of the sky, perhaps by a bomb hidden somewhere on board. or even if this was simply a catastrophic mid air mechanical
failure. we begin with our cnn senior international correspond end who is live at charles de gaulle airport in paris. security first, already changes taking place there? >> absolutely. the french have announced today they will be adding an interest 30 intelligence officers at the scene here in charles de gaulle. that's on top of the 5700 security agents who patrol the terminal. today, and every day for the last few months we have seen armed soldiers patrolling through here making random checks of passengers with their bags. so it is,ed a its highest state of alert. this is also where the investigation into the mystery of egyptair is beginning. they have been interviewing employees and personnel. the last people to have any contact with the plane. that's everybody from baggage handlers to cleaners to catering staff. it's a lot of people to go through. 85,000 people actually have
those red badges or special security access to the area where the plane was. so it's going to take some time to get through it all, brooke. >> all right. atika shubert thank you so much. we'll begin with my panel. i have mitch sill ber here, david susi is with us, cnn safety analyst and former faa safety inspector. and justin greene, cnn aviation analyst and aviation attorney. gentlemen, welcome. let's piggyback first off of atika's point about the sweep this plane in paris. right? so we know 24 hours it can gone through other cities before landing in paris. it's swept -- we know from our guidance, that means they are talking to the caterers on board, the cleaners, any sort of crew, who can talk to me about what a sweep would like like? >> i could.
the crew koss the sweep in some conditions as well. >> the crew from the plane. >> the plane crew that's in there already. sometimes that crew can do that. but additional crew is brought in as well. ning this airport, it would have been a separate crew that would have come in. what they are looking for -- there are some sections -- for example, in the bathroom, you open the cabinet, there is a trash in there. they take the trash out and put the trash bag back in. that's not what a security sweep is. they take the trash out, they move that out of the way, inspect the bucket, look under the sink. there are panels that can be removed in there, they have to be pulled back and you have to look in those. anything that's accessible, any place they can put anything even as small as pop can is looked at during that sweep. >> when i was reading about charles de gaulle, there are 86,000 people -- 8 #,000, who somehow, some form or fashion work at the airport who have these red badges which gave them
access to areas known as reserve zones. obviously some questions about -- if this is even terrorism. we have to be so careful that no one really knows. justin, ju information today, senior egyptian officials saying the nature of how the plane went down leads them to being confident that they believe it was terrorism. describing it as a nose dive. they are so confident in their pilot, the captain and the copilot, that they couldn't have possibly steered it into sea. >> they are looking at is there a known problem with the airplane? is there a maintenance issue they know about and say could that have led to an inflight break up. and they are looking at the pilot, they are saying there is nothing that suggested they did anything. and they are looking at the weather. there is nothing that suggests that the weather could have caused a break up. s that kind of the logical find they are relying on for their finding that it's more likely terrorism. i think it's premature to jump on that ban wagon right now. >> you do?
>> i think a very detailed investigation will happen and is needed in the same way that we investigated twa 800 which initially was thought to be a bomb or a shotdown. -- now, it could be a terrorist attack. if it can happen there, it could happen anywhere. >> we were talking about three hour lines at chicago's o'hair airport. we're careful about what we pack, careful about going through all the different processes. and who knows about the people who are working at the airplane with the access. looking at you, mitch, again, i go back to this point -- we were talking about this before the show started. we are about 36 hours since this plane went down, and still no claim of responsibility from any sort of terrorist organization. i made the point yesterday that we are in the age of twitter, things happen quickly.
they have social media managers with these terrorist organizations. what does that lead you to believe? >> i think you have to look at the broader geopolitical situation. you have an egyptair plane that goes down and a plane that deported from france on its way to egypt. if you think about some of the terrorist groups that are in the mix right now, isis, and al qaeda, and al qaeda-related groups like the coarson group, many of them have both egypt as an enemy, president el sisi has cracked down really hard on islamis groups in egypt. and obviously you know the history in france n. paris not long ago with the isis attacks. >> right. >> isis has generally been forward leaning in claiming when they have taken part in a terrorist attack. we saw it in brussels and saw it in paris. their silence here is quite interesting. what's also worth noting is that al qaeda elements from yemen, the group that put together the underwear bomb. the group that put together the printer cartridge bomb hidden in
printer cartridges that nobody could detect in the u.k. they have moved many of their elements to syria. it's believed they have a better operating base in syria. and they more so than isis are probably more advanced when it comes to trying to attack aaron targets. when i'm thinking about terrorist groups, it makes sense isis doesn't claim it. maybe an al qaeda spin off. >> egypt is saying terrorism, u.s. intelligence says terrorism. you are talking about terrorist organizations. could one single person be capable of pulling something like this thing off? >> we saw it with the sharm el sheik flight. >> soda can size. >> soda can size device put there by someone who was an insider working with the airport. yes, it could have been one person. the question is what's the network of support behind them? >> as far as to both of you, the search area. right? so we know it's mediterranean sea off of one of these greek islands. from what i understand. and we're talking to
oceanographers a little later, it's quite deep, about two miles. you have this composite plane, relatively new, 2003, obviously some pieces floating, some pieces sink. the piece is the tail, which would hold the flight data recorder. talk about how they are going to find that. >> well, with the airbus that crashed, the air france airbus that crashed, the tail was fill floating. that's one of the things that was found. >> two years later? >> two years later was the ground search underneath. >> okay. >> even at that point, the boxes were not in that tail. they had come out because during the disruption, they are heavy boxes and they have mounts, but the mounts aren't designed for a nine g impact. they do end up on the bottom. many times they are not attached to the big structures of the airplane. the underwater locator beacon is sending out a high frequency pulse, about the frequency of a dog whistle.
it's about as loud as a shotgun. under water that transmitts only about a mile and a and a half. when we look for where those boxes are, it should be sending out the signal. remember the towed underwater beacon sensors that they send out to try to find these things? it has to be within that mile and a half before it will pick that sound up. it's challenging and specialized equipment to go in there and find that specific piece. >> let me ask all three of you to stand by. our minds are with the families. we'll talk about what they are going there. many of them in cairo. we'll be talking live to the u.s. navy. they are assisting in the med treenian sea, what they are finding, what they are helping look for. also ahead, the copilot's relatives speaking out to cnn. hear what they and other families are now saying. and any moment, donald trump will address the nra at its conference in kentucky as he tries to win over conservatives. we'll have all of that for you, and more. it's friday, you are watching
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welcome back. you are watching cnn on this friday afternoon. i'm brooke baldwin. i want to take you back to our special live breaking coverage of the presumed 66 lives lost in the mediterranean sea as a result of the crash of egyptair flight ms804. i know officials haven't concluded this was absolute ian act of terror. your aviation minister said it's more likely to be terrorism than a technical issue. what are you hearing? >> actually, we cannot make any speculation for the time being because there is no evidence of any -- any proof whether this is one thing or the other. so i would rather not speculate at this point in time and leave
the facts come when they find the black boxes and they can have evidence of what they are saying. >> on the facts, we do know that they are finding suit cases, seats, body parts. what do you know? can you be specific as far as what else has been found in the mediterranean? >> i think actually our information is limited to what has been declared. you know, so at this point of time, i don't have anything to add to what they have found. i think at this point in time we need to focus on giving the support to the families and the friends for their loss of their loved ones. and we should basically focus on how we can give them all the support possible you know, at this point in time. >> sir, that's exactly where i wanted to go next. you know, have you been in touch with any of the families any
know many of them are there in cairo. >> there are a few families i have been in touch with, some of the local families here in cairo. you know, some other officials have been to the other families. we continue to do this. i'll continue to do this tomorrow morning as well. we try to give all the support and the care and love to those families and give them a comfort and do the best week to make them -- to make it easier for them. >> can you just tell me about one conversation? as much as you are willing to share, sir, just about the questions they are asking, how they are holding up. >> i think the question, the simple question everybody is trying to figure out, what has taken place? what is the cause? and as you know, in this type of instance, you know, things takes time. and unless you have definite proof of what has been the
facts, you know, we is yshould really spec late. we should get out of the speculation. not be part of this kind of, you know, right or wrong speculation. i think we should wait until we get all the facts and then share them and be transparent about it. >> let's talk about your country. i know that you have said -- you know, you reason is had security issues in egyptian airports. it's 100% secure, except for one major exception, which is what happened last october with that russia metro jet explosion. 224 people were killed after taking off from sharm el sheik . and i know that tourism in your country accounts for 11% of your work force, your gdp. since then, tourism has dropped off 5%. you know, for people who have egypt, you know, your beautiful country, on their travel bucket list, what would you tell someone right now?
>> i tell everybody that we currently work with all the global forces to make egypt secure, you know, the egyptian airports are no different than any other airports in france or england and the u.k., sorry, or in the u.s. you know, we face the same threat from terrorism. egypt have fighted the ballots of terrorism all over on behalf of the word. and today we are encouraging people to travel in spite of the instance. incidents can take place. we've seen what can happen in many other countries -- without specifying what happened in every country. but you know, we're exposed to the worldwide terrorism. and i say we should actually give people the chance and the liberty to move, to travel, to enjoy themselves.
you know, it's part of giving the hope, the prosperity, the positivity to the world. people -- let these things don't stop people from enjoying their life,an joying the time, being able to travel everywhere. you know, we work globally to make things easier, safer, faster for them. and that is the goal of all over, of all the governments all over the world. >> minister of tourism joining us live from cairo. i look forward to meeting you in cairo one day. i appreciate your time. again, our haerts going out to your country and the families who are brumed to have lost loved ones in this horrendous crash. thank you so much, sir, for our time. >> this is our biggest concern is how to support all the families and all the human beings to make them feel much comfortable and put them at ease at this very difficult time.
thank you. >> absolutely. thank you so much. thank you. we will stay on our special live coverage, obviously, of this downed airplane, but when we come back, we will take you live to louisville, kentucky. we are waiting to hear from the presumptive republican nominee speaking to the nra conference there in kentucky. donald trump. we'll take you there live coming up. g powerful sunscreen? yes! neutrogena® ultra sheer. unbeatable protection helps prevent early skin aging and skin cancer with a clean feel. the best for your skin. ultra sheer®. neutrogena®. ♪ ♪ (charge music) you wouldn't hire an organist without hearing them first. charge! so why would you invest without checking brokercheck? check your broker with brokercheck.
understand exactly what brought this egyptair plane down just about 36 hours ago. mitch sill ber is back with us. david susi, justin greene. we were talking about potential threads of terrorism, but also being extraordinarily careful. you know, the egyptian tourism minister making the point where let's not jump out ahead of this. obviously you have all these different families many of whom are sitting in cairoan an emotional roger coaster trying to determine what could have possibly happened. other than what took the plane down, what are your biggest questions? >> you know, one of the things -- i want to compliment the minister for what he said. unfortunately, yesterday, the families went through a roller coaster. initially they were told. >> you have represented the families in major crashes. >> i have. i have to sit through what they go through. i have had to go through them. what happened yesterday is the families were told we found the wreckage. the families -- until they see
their loved ones, they are holding out hope some miracle may have happened. in the malaysia airlines 370 case, my clients, many of them still don't accept there is absolutely no hope. yesterday they were told they found the airplane. and then on your set christine said i don't about it. then they said no, it wasn't it. and then today they found it. >> are they watching the news, are they paying attention to every nugel. >> every single thing. and responsible coverage like we had with you and christine yesterday is positive. some irresponsible coverage where there is a rush to judgment is not so great. >> david susi? i mean -- >> you know what's most frustrating for me is the fact during that time when these people are waiting to hear information, we do this every single time there is an aircraft down. for that long period of time. it's avoidable. we've known this for long time.
there is technology available where we can see what's happening in the cockpit in real time all the time and know exactly what could have happened to the aircraft at that moment. we don't do that. why don't we do that? why isn't that available for people? because we have such a short memory that once this happens and once we do find conclusively what happened, we don't follow that up with, how do we prevent it from happening again, because you walk away thinking, it will never happen to me, it will never happen again. in fact, it will. we need to prepare for that by getting streaming information all the way from the aircraft. streaming video from the cockpits. >> we don't have that. >> we do not. >> i hear miles o'brien saying why in 2016 do we not have that. >> that's right. >> i want to remind our viewers what we know at this point. >> for me, if it's terrorism, who did it and how did they do it? is al qaeda trying to get back into the mix? they haven't done anything spectacular. but airlines have certainly been one of their hallmark type attack. and we don't have any claim of
responsibility from isis. and then, if so, how did they do it? was there an insider at charles de gaulle armt? we know the airport has fired almost 1,000 people over the last few months. was there an insider in one of the other cities. where do we have to look to say there is a vulnerability that we've missed to date? >> there are all of those different pieces of this whole story. then of course the u.s. has jumped in to try to help, the u.s. navy is assisting in the recovery of egyptair flight 804. it is deployed actually three surveillance plane, p 3 orions over the mediterranean sea. we have on the phone mission commander who flew the first flight last night in search of this missing plane. he is lieutenant commander brian biloshki. commander, thank you so much for hopping on the phone. i can imagine you all are extraordinarily busy. first of all, tell me about the
orion, how you are able to help. >> the p 3 orion is one of the navy's long range maritime patrol aircraft. it has sensors that allow us to be effective at search-and-rescue. we deploy the sensors on the aircraft such as radar and high definition cameras as well as visual observers to search the ocean for indications of a crash site or anything associated with a missing aircraft. >> so you were part of the first flight. tell me how it went. what did you see, if anything? >> well, we launched out of naval air station in the middle of the afternoon. and took just a few hours to transit out to begin our search in the middle mediterranean. and we observed a good search conditions out there with decent visibility and fairly calm seas.
we spent just under six hours out in the area searching working with the helenic armed forces who were coordinating the rescue efforts when we were out there. our search did not turn up anything associated with the missing aircraft. >> how -- explain to me how it is that you all are i imagine just playing a role and then communicating to whoever may be, you know, on the water, on the sea once you do spot something. explain that process to me. >> okay. i think your question is if we did something, how would that play out? >> correct. yes, sir. >> okay. in our case, we are cutting the aerial search. our first aircraft -- and we have aircraft out there currently. the helenic armed forces there is a joint rescue operation center operating out of greece, we were working through them. in the event we would have discovered something or perhaps noticed something that required
further investigation we would have passed that report through the helenic armed forces that were coordinating the efforts and then they would have used appropriate resources to make a further investigation of that object. >> you he no, i was talking to a oceanographer commander on my show yesterday. she is saying there is a lot of debris in this part of the sea in general, there is a lot of traffic. how are you supposed to know what could be a piece this particular airplane versus something totally unrelated? >> well, that's true. there's -- having spent several years flying over the ocean, and there is debris throughout the igs ocean, right from passing surface ships and things like that. you have to just rely on some good judgment and common sense, and you have to kind of understand what you are looking for. in this case, thing that could have been associated with a missing aircraft. we're all familiar with components that make up an airplane or the things carried inside of an airplane. so if we identify something that is worth looking at we can use
some of our sensors on board to look a little closer and make an informed decision and go from there. >> hopefully, you are able to see something and help, you know, the search effort, and ultimately help some of these families find answers. lieutenant commander from the 6th fleet from the u.s. navy. i truly appreciate you hopping on the phone, sir. thank you so much. >> it's my pleasure. >> thank you. we will get you back to of course this live breaking news coverage of the egyptair flight. also, we're watching and waiting to hear from the presumed republican nominee in the race here to become the next president of the united states. watching for donald trump to stand behind that podium in louisville, kentucky at the nra conference. we'll take him live any moment. or, "i'm hungry." what if your body said something else might be wrong? gynecologic cancers - cervical, ovarian and uterine cancers - have symptoms. so pay attention. if your body says something may be wrong....
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we're told the weather was clear we egyptair flight 804 plunged into the mediterranean sea. now painstaking efforts are being put into finding the wreckage and the black boxes. it's said it disappeared 180 miles north of alexandria. now we have a visual look at the plane's trajectory and the obstacles search remembers facing. >> the flight path was pretty clear. we seem to know what happen along the way. the challenge is how you fine what might be in the water here. the mediterranean sea is largely enclosed. it doesn't behave quite like oceans but it still brings challenges. the debris was found here about 180 miles north of alexander
rhea. the mediterranean sea overall afternoons out to be a little bit less than a mile deep in many places. that's a challenging environment. look at what we are talking about here. the actual sea depth in this case, over here you are going to be a little bit less than a mile in the average sea depth. over here, though, where we are looking is much, much deeper. and this is a big area we are talking about as well. right now they are talking about a circle with a 40 mile radius for about 5,000 square miles to search out there. that's a pretty big area. and they are trying to limit where they are -- or grid off where they are finding these various pieces. as i mentioned. some body parts, some parts of the plane, some seats. and of course one of the things they really want to find are big parts of the plane that might contain the flight data recorder and the voice recorder. for that, we have people out there from the french, from the greeks, and the egyptians and the united states.
the united states has sent in several of these submarine hunter planes that are good at deequity tegting things under the water. again, this is very far down here. even if you have things to guide you for example, the oil slick they think is out here. this is 20 miles from the last known position. you get an idea, there is a lot of water out there, auto evan with includes. >> perfectly teed up my next conversation. let me bring in two guests. a sea operations and submersibles specialist and also a forensic audio expert and a specialist in forensic evidence. gentlemen, tom foreman hit on a couple of issues. paul, let me begin with you. i know we talked about this before, sadly in other incidents. when we talk about the flight data recorder and the voice recorder what are those? what can be heard when they find them? >> these are two devices that are meant to store and record all the voice that happens in the cockpit. the pilot, the copilot, the two-way radio, and also there is
a cockpit area mic that pecks up any sounds in the cockpit, including alerts, alarms, engine sounds from outside. anything that would alert us to a problem. and the other one is flight data recorder that records hundreds of different parts of the plane, that is different subsystems, pressures, voltages, pneumatic. everything. just to be able to put together the puzzle and tell us exactly what happened at the very final stage where it ended. >> let me just hit pause on this conversation. we've just learned that the nra has now officially endorsed trump as the next president of the united states. here he is. obviously, front and center n louisville, kentucky on the stage here at this nra conference. giving the thumbs-up. let's listen in. [ cheers and applause ] thank you very much.
this is amazinamazing. i did not know that. i knew i was doing well. but i did not know that. and i've been a member for a long time. and my boys are members. and they are much better shooters than i am. i tell you, they know more about guns -- there might be two or three people in this room, but believe it or not, not many. to get the endorsement, believe me s a fantastic honor. [ cheers and applause ] and i just said to wayne, and i just said to chris, i will not let you down. remember that. i will not let you down. and you know, i wrote a few remarks and i'm actually going to read them because we go into a little detail. but i will tell that you hillary clinton -- you know i call her crooked hillary because all you have to do is read any newspaper you want. but hillary clinton wants to abolish the second amendment. we are not talking about change it. she wants to abolish the second amendment.
we're not going to let that happen. i can tell you. that we're going to preserve it. we're going to cherish it. we're going to take care of it. okay? they keep chipping away. they talk about the magazines, they talk about the bullets. we're going to take care of it. a couple of things before i give you some more detailed remarks. i feel really happy with what's going on. you know, the fox poll came out three days ago. in the fox poll i'm leading hillary 41-44. and last night, rasmussen, which is a highly respected poll, came out. trump, 42. crooked hillary clinton, 37. so we're doing well. now w that, we have a long way to go. but if you get every one of your friends to go vote -- because there is a big difference. you know n a lot of things there is a difference. some are subtle. some are big. by the way, we're in kentucky, we're going to put the miners back to work. before i forget about that.
we are going to put the miners -- we just left. and i also won kentucky. so i love kentucky. i used to work in cincinnati. for two summers i worked in cincinnati doing a job with my father. and i loved -- i loved cincinnati, and i'd come over the line and i would he be in kentucky. you wouldn't -- you would be surprised how much i know about kentucky. but it's an amazing place. but i said when i won new york -- because we won new york in a landslide, and then pennsylvania and maryland. and we won everything. we are winning everything. we won connecticut, delaware, rhode island. and then we went to west virginia. and boy did i win. did we do well in west virginia. wow! but all land slides. we won -- in all of the states i mentioned and more, every single county, in every single state. that's called a victory. and we won by massive percentages, in the 60s. and some in the 70s.
then of course we wend to indiana. as you know, that was going to be the fire wall for the other side. and it turn out to be a massive victory for us again. it didn't hurt that bobby knight came out and said i want trump to win. that didn't hurt. if you are in indiana, and bobby knight endorses you, i guess that's about as good as it gets. so i just want to say that of i've been watching what's going on. and i've been looking at airplanes getting blown up in the air, and lots of bad things happening. it's just not the same. and we're going to bring it back. and we're going to bring it back to a real place, where we don't have to be so frightened, where we don't have to be so afraid, and you know what's happening in the schools, and you know what's happening everywhere. we're going to bring it back. and you folks are going to be so happy. and you are going to be so proud of your country again. just remember. [ applause ] bernie sanders, who i'm sure you all love, he did say one thing
that was very interesting. he said that hillary clinton is unequalified to be the president of the united states. [ cheers and applause ] and he said that -- and it's just -- you know, one of those things, he said she suffers from bad jmt. and see does. you look at so many of her decisions have been bad. so i think we're going to do really, really well. and i look forward to it -- i actually look very forward to the debates. i have loved the debates. i don't know. i have never debated before. all of a sudden i have all these debates. that was a big question mark in my mind. how will i do in debates? i'm debating people that were on their national debating teams, and all of these top debaters. but they never had people interrupting them every other word that say, you are a liar, you are a liar, trying to speak and they can't speak. you would have done the same. i know a lot of the audience. you would have done the same. so i just want to give this -- it's so important tomy. i wrote it down. again, my sons have been member
of the nra for many, many years. and they are incredible. they have so many rifles and so many guns sometimes i even get a little bit concerned. i say that's a lot. but i will tell you, they are -- they know so much about it. really, they are surrogates. they go around and speak. and every time they speak to a gun organization or a club, people call me and they say, your boys are great boys and boy do they know their business. so it's one of those things. and that's the way we want it. and i mention so often we talk about paris or we talk about san bernardino. and nobody had guns. you know, pair sis probabris is the world the toughest place to have a gun. the touchest. france generally, but paris in particular. when these thugs walked in. thugs. the press used to call them master mind. i said that's why people are joining, they are coming in because you are using the word mastermind. thugs. i call him the man with the
filthy cap. the white cap and it was filthy use. the press has stopped using that term. they are among the most dishonest i've ever met but they stopped using the term mastermind. they use that term and wonder why our ott youth is going and fighting for isis. i think it's gotten better from that spand standpoint. if you look at paris, 130 people killed, hundreds of people still in the hospital. just horribly wounded, can never be the same. horribly wounded. and these guys came in, boom, boom, you, over here, boom, and they just stood there and just shot everybody. no guns on the other side, folk. if you would have had guns on the other side -- if i took a couple of these folks in here, some especially wearing the red caps, make america great again, i promise there wouldn't have been 130 people killed and hundreds of people lying in the hospital to this day. it might not have happened. because if they knew there were guns in the room it might not have happened.
but if it did, you would have had bullets going in the opposite direction, and believe me, the carnage would not have been the same by any stretch of the imagination. [ cheers and applause ] and i tell -- thank you. i tell the same story on san bernardino. here's two people. i guess she radicalized him. who knows? who knows? it's a mess. we're in a mess, folks, a mess. radical islamic terrorism. we have a president doesn't mention the words. doesn't want to talk about it. if you don't want to talk about it, you are never going to solve a very big problem. and we're talking a worldwide problem. we're not talking here. we're not talking kentucky. we're talking all over the world this is a problem, and we have a president doesn't want to mention the name. you have san bernardino. 14 people. they worked with these two. they worked with them. they gave them a baby shower. they had a baby.
the people they worked with gave them a baby shower. they walked in. no guns on the other side. they had the guns. and they killed 14 people. many wounded. many in the hospital to this day. but they wounded many. but they killed 14 of their coworkers. and the coworkers thought they were friends. so there is something going on. you no i tell you, again, same story, if we had guns on the other side, it wouldn't have been that way. i would have -- boom. if we had guns on the other side, it wouldn't have been that way. [ cheers and applause ] and then you have the fun-free zones. the gun-free zones. that's real. we had a case -- you know about a year and a half ago was the first i really heard of this. and where you had the five military people -- great people. one was a master marksman, a master with anything he touched having to do with guns, weapons, anything he touched. and they were told, this is --
this is on a military base. on a military base. you have got to put your guns away. put your guns -- these are soldiers, people representing us. these are top of the line. these were five great brave incredible soldiers. put your guns away. so their guns are locked up, put in a different area of the place. and this whack job walks in and starts shooting and killed all five of them. gun-free zones and. we are getting rid of gun-free zones. okay? i can tell you. [ cheers and applause ] we're getting rid of them. [ cheers and applause ] >> thank you. thank you. that wasn't part of my speech, i must be honest with you. i don't know. i don't know, maybe i shouldn't read you what i have here. but in fact, if i would have known teleprompters, i would
have used them. i have started to use them a little bit. they are not bad. you never get yourself in trouble when you use them. it's too easy. we have a president who uses teleprompters. it's too easy. we should have non-teleprompter speeches only when you are running for president. you find out about people. the other way, you don't find out about anybody. so, the second amendment is under a threat like never before. crooked hillary clinton is the most anti-gun meant second amendment candidate ever to run for office. and as i said before, she wants to abolish the second amendment. she wants to take your guns away. she wants to abolish it. just remember that -- and the laid hero, he was a great guy, charleston hesston, who many of you knew. i met him a few times. he was an incredible guy, did battle with the clintons to protect our second amendment.
the nra has led the fight time and time again to protect our fundamental freedoms. this is an amazing group. i tell you, chris, and wayne, and all of the people -- and i've gotten to know a lot of -- these are incredible people and they really believe. this isn't like a job. they really, really believe. and we're all lucky to have people like that. i will tell you. really lucky. [ applause ] of course if they didn't endorse me, maybe i wouldn't say. that i don't know. i would. hillary clinton wants to reverse the supreme court decision d.c. versus heller upholding the right to keep and bear arms. hillary said, the supreme court is wrong on the second amendment. that's bad. that's like what she said about the miners. we're going to put the miners and the mines out of business. then she goes -- right? then she goes -- oh, boy, i tell
you, west virginia, how were they -- i hate to say i won kentucky, but i won west virginia by even more. i really -- of course she made that statement after i had already won committee ken. >> win them all! >> we're going to win them all. if hiary gets a point her judges -- look, defense is number one. we have to broke our country. economy is important -- everything is important but without defense we don't have a country. our military, it's being decapitated. what they are doing to our military is incredible. i saw over the weekend a documentary on our -- you know, on our great airmen. and these are people that are flying our jets. and they are running out of parts for our fighter jets. and these are fighter pilots. these are incredible men. they are going to junk yards -- plane grave yards where the planes are, grave yards for the old planes. and they are taking parts off -- they are cannibalizing, they are
taking parts off the flaens and putting them onto the jets. and i'm saying, is this the united states? why don't we have new equipment. a man got up, great guy, and he looked as good or better than tom cruise. you know what i'm talking about. he said i've been in this for 20 years. it used to be so incredible. now it's like a different world. the equipment, the way it's maintained. everything. it's like a different world. and i just have to say, just to interrupt what i'm going to be talking about -- i have to say, we're going to make our military bigger and better and stronger than ever before. and nobody -- nobody is going to push us around. nobody. [ applause ] nobody. [ cheers and applause ] thank you. and by the way, as part of that, we are going to take care of our
great veterans. and i have to tell you, the proper way. the proper way. all right. thank you, everybody. thank you. if hillary gets to appoint her judges, you know, one of the biggest and most important reasons to win this time -- it's very unusual. sometimes you get no judges to appoint. sometimes you go for years and there is no judges. probably there will be a minimum. you have scalia, he was one of the grass. his position is up. great. he was great. you have southern cal yachlt you have one before you even start. assuming and i'm sure that niche and the guys are going to be able to hold out. i have no doubt about it because we don't want anybody taking that slot. but you have scalia, and you will probably have three -- it could be four, and it can even be five judges. so i think in terms of -- and we're talking about a four-year period. and of course we intend to be there for eight years.
but we'll make it so good in four, you will probably say you don't need to do it any longer, mr. president. but i can't stress in any stronger fashion whoever the next president is going to appoint from three to five judge. and if it's hillary or whoever -- assuming she is allowed to run. you know what? what she did with her e-mail is so criminal, is so dishonest, is so shocking that she shunt be allowed to run but it looks like they are going to let her run. and that's okay with me, because really, i do want to run against her. i have to be honest with you. so, if she gets to appoint her junes, she will, as part of it, abolish the second amendment. and i have to say, that would be, in my opinion, that's what she's going to go for. and it's a little like she did with the coal miners. she said about -- you know, she is going to put the coal miners, put the mines out of business.
and then she went to west virginia, and she said well i tried to retraktd. she tried to retract it. it didn't work well. she got beaten badly. hillary wants to disarm vulnerable citizens in high crime neighborhoods whether it is a young single mom in florida or a grandmother in ohio, hillary wants them to be defenseless, wants to take away any chance they have of survival. by the way, you have men and you have women sitting in an apartment. and outside is tremendous crime. tremendous crimes of all kinds. and they need to be protected. and you know, the only way they are going to be able to protect then selves. if you take that gun away from them. it's gonna be very unfair situation. and that's why we're going to call her heartless hillary. we can do without that. shourks i like crooked hillary better. i put forth -- and you probably saw it a few days ago. i put forth a list of judges who will protect and defend all of
drug trafficking felons and gang members who prey on civilians. i want to till i really learned a lot about the border. in fact, two years ago you probably saw 16500 border patrol agents endorse donald trump. and we've gotten great endorsements. to have the endorsement from nra today, and to have the endorsement from the border patrol agents. i was talking to them. these are incredible people who want to do their job. that's why they are endorsing me. you know, they are told to stand back, don't do it. they want to do their job. these are incredible people. the first time they have ever endorsed a presidential candidate. and 16500. i'm really honored by that. [ applause ] this is hillary clinton's agenda, too, to release the violent criminals from jail. she wants them all released. she wants people released that you wouldn't want to walk on the street with. you wouldn't want to look at. and you know, whether it's kate
in san francisco, you see what happened -- or jamil, i've become great friends with his father, jamil was shot in the face three times by somebody who wasn't supposed to be here. or i always say this, because this was tragic, a 65 yearly veteran, a woman who was a great woman, raped, sodomized, and killed, by an illegal immigrant. wasn't supposed to be here. we're going to straighten it out. and by the way, this doesn't have to do with guns, per se, but maybe it has to do with a lot of other things. we're going to build a wall. going to be a great wall. we're going to have borders again. people are going to come into the country, but they are coming into the country legally, folk. they are coming in legally. we're going to keep our borders open. and i'll tell you, but they are going to be open when people come in legally. hillary wants to just keep them open, anybody can come across. and that's what's been happening and the crime is violent and a lot. and lots of other things are
happening with the drugs pouring across. so she is putting the most vulnerable americans in jeopardy. and this is a risk that we can no longer afford. we've had enough. i think we've had enough. wouldn't you say we've had like -- [ applause ] >> in trying to overturn the second amendment, hillary clinton is telling everyone, and every women living in a dangerous community, that she doesn't have the right to defend herself. so you have a woman living in a community, a rough community, a bad community. sorry, you can't defend yourself. that is so unfair, and that is so egregious. and i'll tell you what. my poll numbers with women are starting to go up. i never thought of it. this should really lift them up, right? starting to go up. i will say, my poll numbers with men are through the roof. but i like women more than men. come on, women, let's go.
come on. and most people know that about me. most people know that. this is the most basic human right of all, but hillary wants to strip it away and strip it away from women, and all others. hillary clinton will release violent criminals from jail more so than even obama. she has more open policy than obama, if that's possible. and put innocent americans at risk. i'm going to put criminals behind bars and guarantee that law-abiding americans have the right to self-defense. 100%. [ applause ] thank you. thank you. there are 13 million right to carry permit holders in the united states. i happen to be one of them. in the past -- nobody knows
that. boy, would i surprise somebody if they hit trump. if i wasn't -- if i wasn't surrounded by, like, the largest group of secret service people -- who by the way are fantastic people, and our police are fantastic, fantastic people. we have to give a standing ovation to our police. we have to. they are fantastic people. [ cheers and applause ] amazing. they do such a great job. they are so unfairly treated. but they know -- and they know how the people feel about them. thank you. that's great. in the past 30 years, the number of right to carry states has gone up seven-fold. these are among the most law-abiding folks statistically
in the entire country. they have the right to carry. they are among the most -- you know, they do statistics on everything, right, everything. and these are among the most -- in fact, they are like at the top of the list. in florida, for example, they have issued more than 3 million conceal carry permits in the past 30 years. only 168 have been revoked. that's .006 percent. so very, very few, and just no difficulty. hillary wants to go into the opposite direction. she said that president obama didn't go far enough when he executed this order, when he signed this order. and he's not going far enough. he has gone so far. he has gone too far. we're going to stop it. and we will unsign lots of different things, including some of those terrible executive orders. believe me, they are going to be unsigned so fast.
[ cheers and applause ] i do. i would love him to run as an independent. then it would be the three of us on the stage. i would love that. the second amendment is on the ballot in november. the only way to save our second amendment is to vote for a person that you all know named donald trump. okay? i will tell you. i will never let you down. i will protect our second amendment. i will protect our country. our military will be strong. our borders will be enforced. we'll get rid of common core, which is a disaster. we'll bring -- we'll bring education local. so important. our education is a mess. we're going to get rid of obama care. we're going to have a great, great plan as a substitute.
obama care is out of control. the new costs, as you know, they are going to be revealed on november 1st. they are going to be through the roof. and by the way, don't let this happen -- we'll have to speak to mitch. obama is trying to get it delayed until after the election. the new cost will be revealed on november 1st unless he gets it changed. and we don't want that to happen. they will be so astronomical and will show what a total failure and disaster obama care is. we will repeal it and we will relays it with something great. okay? believe me. we're going to have strong borders. and we're going to make the goest trade deals. every country worldwide -- every country in the world is ripping off our great country like we are children, like taking candy from a baby. our trade deals will be renegotiated. we won't be having trade deficits of $500 billion a year
with china anymore, folks. they won't be taking our jobs out of here, in kentucky and lots of other places -- every place. they won't be taking our jobs and bringing them into mexico, like with nabisco where they leave chicago, moving to mexico, and so many other countries -- companies. carrier. you take a look at carrier air-conditioning. just left indiana. they are leaving indiana. they are moving to mexico. that's not happening with me. because when they make their air conditioners and they sell them across our now very strong border, believe me, they are going to pay a tax, and they are going to say we're not moving to mexico anymore. it's so simple. it's so simple. so we're going to have -- [ applause ] we're going to have great trade agreements. we're going to become a strong nation again. we're going to save our social skurmt we're going to save our medicare. we're going to be so proud of this country. you're going to be proud of your
president. but i don't care about that. you are going to be proud of your country again. and we're going to start winning again because we don't win anymore. we never win. we don't win on trade. we don't win with the military. we can't beat isis. believe me, we're going to knock the hell out of isis. we have no choice. we're going the knock the hell out of isis. [ cheers and applause ] so we are going to start winning again. and i have fun saying it. and i say it a lot. but there is nothing better. and some of you have heard it. but we are going to win, win, win. we're going to win with military. we're going to win at the borders. we're going to win with trade. we're going to win at everything. and some of you are friends. and you are going to call. you are going to say, mr. president, please, we can't take
it anymore, we can't win anymore like this. mr. president, you are driving us kaez. you are winning too much. please, mr. president, not so much. and i'm going to say, i'm sorry, we're going to keep winning, because we are going to make america great again. thank you. we love you. thank you. thank you, everybody. thank you, kentucky. thank you, everybody. thank you. [ cheers and applause ] >> wow, listen to that crowd. donald trump saying thank you, says he is going to keep winning. referring to himself as president. in louisville kentucky. standing ovation. he hit on all kinds of things. first off, he came up after being endorsed by the nra. the nafl rifle association said it was a fabulous honor. got huge applause. said he warned to get rid of gun free zones. said hillary clinton wants to abolish the second amendment.
referred to as crooked hillary over and over. heartless hillary. called on the former secretary of state to release her own list of potential security justices as we saw mr. trump did earlier this week with his 11 names. said he is going to knock the hell out of isis. if i may, he also said the media is among some of the most dishonest people i've met. if i may, he doesn't waste any time picking up the phone to call members of media. just saying. i have sarah murray and m. >> yes, sir lee as well. m.j. lee, to you first, that was like vintage ump doctor, getting the crowd fired up. conservative crowd, dropping a lot of red meat along the way. what did you make of it? >> a ton of red meat. this is a influential endorse men by the nra. it is a powerful and influential group. a conservative group that other groups look to to see if whether
a candidate is conservative. the man speaking before donald trump called this a moment, a moment for the party to come together. he said that if we don't stand together and if we don't elect this man essentially as our next president, our freedoms will be gone. and something else that chris cox, who was a top nra lobbyist said, if your preferred candidate dropped out of the race, it's time to get over it. calling on folks who are still having doubts and concerns about donald trump to say drop it, it's time to come together and focus on taking on hillary clinton. >> m.j. lee. thank you. sarah murray, sarah murray there in the room. i can still hear the applause, sarah murray. how did it feel for you hearing it in person? >> well, brooke, it's interesting because of course we know in the past donald trump has not been quite as strident in protecting gun rights. he called for increased background checks. he called for a couple other
restrictions. and he has really changed that entirely since taking to the campaign trail essentially saying that the answer to gun violence is for more people to have guns in more places. he said he doesn't want more gun free zones. he said that wasn't in his written notes or prepared remarks he was saying that off the cuff which i guess will be a new policy proposal for him. i think it's interesting to see how he changed his perception among this group. there wasn't any reservation from the nra in throwing their support behind donald trump. they look at him and say look there was no way they were going to endorse hillary clinton. no way they were going to endorse bernie sanders. so it was time for the nra to say to its membership your preferred candidate might not be here anymore but this guy is a better alternative for what we care about for the second amendment than bernie sanders or hillary clinton. >> let me bring in a republican and a democrat to broaden this out. jeff steen, a former aide to
senator john mccain. and cnn political commentator angela rye, used to serve on the congressional black caucus. welcome to both of you, boris, to sarah murray as point, that mr. trump once go express support for assault weapon bans. i was reading go an interview from 1989 in a interview with larry king furthering his frustration that guns fall into the hands of bad people. the about-face. how do you explain that to conservatives who are wondering about his flip-flop. >> you don't have to explain it to conservatives. the nra is basing their endorse men on where mr. trump stands now in 2016. not in 1999. that's what matter the most. smart folks evolve on issues. they that i can in what 'they see around the country. that's what donald trump has done. you heard the absolutely excited endorse machine by the nra and
the crowd in the room. not just the executives but the crowd in the room. that's what matters the most. so much for the talk for the conservatives not coalescing behind donald trump. you have got the nra behind him and full-fledged support of the republican party movement. >> angela rye, we have heard donald trump say hillary clinton wants to abolish the second amendment is that true? >> it's not true. it has been disproven by politic-fact. they called the trump campaign to respond to the claims he has made and couldn't get a response. they have also talked to hillary clinton's campaign and they made it abundantly clear that hillary clinton wants to to no such thing. what she has continued to say is ensure there is a proper balance between human beings -- american's right to bear arms and what actually happens here. the fact that there are shootings that happen. i also want to draw your
attention, brooke, to a quote from donald trump from of course his beloved twitter account. and that is from 2012 when he said, president obama spoke for me and every american in his remarks in newtown, connecticut. that was in december, 2012 after children lost their lives to gun vie lens. this is not about pandering. this is about life and death at the hands of gun violence. hillary clinton has touted the importance of background checks. at one point donald trump in his right mind did the same thing. it is time for him to find him, his conscious and be honest about the detrimental impacts of gun violence. >> politicizing newtown is not the right way to go. >> what else is not the right way to go is lying. >> let me speak. >> one voice. unvoice, guys. boris, go. >> this is his twitter account. >> i'm not sure why you speak for well meaning americans.
it is exactly why donald trump and the americans are going to be taking the white house because democrats and liberals think they are the only well meaning ones. >> that's never what i said. >> and all the folks that support the second amendment are not well meaning. >> that's not what i said. >> go ahead and denigrate -- that's why you will loose in november. >> this is what your candidate does. you take parts of sentences and turn them into something that you say authoritatively. >> did you not say -- >> author at a timively. >> let her finish. >> you can try to bully me gist like your candidate does. >> i'm not bullying, you -- >> the point i'm raising to you is when you go ahead and you say something authoritatively and just because you pars my words doesn't make it fact. hillary clinton has never said -- you said it. >> hillary clinton has never said that she wants to abolish the second amendment. yes or no. is that true or false. >> dismantling the second amendment is the same thing as
aboli abolishing. >> so dismajtd mamgtsing is different than ensuring there are checks and balances. >> you are dismantling it. >> no, i'm not, i'm making sure we know you are parsing words. >> let me jump in. hillary clinton has said she wants to protect responsible gun owners. >> who decides who those people are. or is it up to the constitution and we have the second amendment in place. let's take a step back. angela is concerned about donald trump because he is attractive to republicans and some democrats. and hillary clinton can't put away bernie sanders, who is a socialist. before you concern yourself with donald trump, i'd look to secure the nomination, which hillary clinton has not done yet. >> that's not my -- that's not up to me. it's up to her campaign. what we're doing right now is talking about what donald trump just -- >> who are you supporting? >> i'm not committed. that's not for you to decide. >> i am committed. >> come on. hang on. >> let me finish my point,
boris. what we're doing today is talking about donald trump's remarks before the nra. i brought something up because it's not politicizing the issue. what i'm telling you is in his right mind at one point, donald trump understood the importance of gun control in this country. and now conveniently before the nra, before nra members, he is bragging on how many guns his sons own, he is bragging about the fact that he is a nra member and that they are nra members and he lying. he lied three times about hillary clinton's position on the second amendment. you should listen to my full citizens sentence and let me get to the period. what i said was he lied about her wanting to abolish the second amendment. >> you are not getting my point you. >> don't want to address that point because you know it is a lie as well. >> there is no lying -- >> okay, okay, okay. you two, thanks thank you so much. i hear the passion in your voices and the passion. it is a just may, six months to go. boris and angela, thank you. >> thank you. >> thank you.
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>> announcer: this is cnn breaking news. we are getting breaking news out of the nation's capitol, specifically outside of the white house. officers cleared the white house north lawn because of some ongoing security incident. we can tell you the president of the united states is not on the property. that said let's go to joe johns who is there at the white house.
joe johns, what's happening? >> well, we've gotten conflicting reports, quite frankly, brooke. what we do know is that the secret service asked everybody to come inside here a little while ago. and there are reports of a shooting here. i've talked to d.c. police. they have told me that they have a report of a shooting involving the secret service that occurred around 17th and e streets, which is very nearby. on the other hand, we have reports that the u.s. park police has said a shooting occurred on west executive drive here on the white house complex. that's significant because west executive drive is a secure area, presumably only invitees or people who hold badges to get into the white house complex can get into that secure area. so conflicting reports, reports of shootings from two different law enforcement agencies here in
the washington area that a shooting has occurred somewhere on or near the white house grounds. and that is about all we know. it is clear, also, that the secret service has locked down a lot of the area around the white house. we've been in contact with the secret service and have been told that they will get back to us. so secret service is not confirming anything. reports of a shooting in, around, near the white house, possibly on west executive drive, which is concerning because it's a secure area. brooke, back to you. >> okay. joe johns thank you so much. phil mott i'm going to put you on the spot here. we were going to paulk about the plane. i want to bring you in, former cia. you know washington. you heard what joe was saying. sounds like -- let me add, this this is according to police, officers drew guns, orred reporters to move inside. he was in the briefing room, that's where all the reporters are. and officers describe the white house as a condition red. >> look one of the things you
need to focus on here. there is going to be an abundance of caution. i wouldn't read a terrible amount of what they were telling the press. executive area is answer closed area next to the west wing. if there is an event there that's significant than something happening in the city. the city is a couple of hundred yards outside the white house. major urban areas. where this incident happening, the difference between something happening on 17th street and west executive avenue is what i would be focusing on. >> what he said, two different agencies, shots on white house grounds or near white house grounds. >> yes. >> have you heard of something like this before? >> we've had white house fence jumpers before. >> fence jumpers, firing a gun. >> not only did i serve at the white house. the fbi is not far away. that's a densely populated area,
a lot of foot traffic, all kind of standard urban traffic going through that area. if somebody said there was a shot blocks away and it's unrelated, i am not surprised that's not related. west executive area, who was it who got a pass and carried a weapon into this environment? >> joe johns, let me bring you back n. you are holed up inside of the briefing room as per protocol right now. again, if you are just joining us, reports of a shooting on or near white house grounds. the president is not on property. but, joe, pens pen avenue, lafayette park there on the back side of the house -- can you walk our viewers through what is in that general vicinity? >> it is a large complex. as you said, lafayette park across the street from the white house. as you walk your way around, you see the old eisenhower executive office building. obviously we have the west wing
on the grounds. it's a fairly large area. and there is activity here from time to time. we have had situations with fence jumpers, even people -- one man, walking over the fence and into the house, which caused a great deal of concern. the secret service clearly taking all of this very seriously, lo seriously. looking out the windows here, i have seen guns drawn. and an air of real seriousness here. nonetheless, i cannot tell you how to reconcile those reports of a shooting. it doesn't say that someone was shot. it just says -- i mean the indication to me from covering law enforcement is that at least shots were fired. >> uh-huh. >> either around 17th and e streets or along the west executive drive. anybody's guess at this point. waiting to hear from the secret
service. i did see a couple people walk outside the door here. so it does not appear that we are confined inside the white house proper at this time. waiting to hear from officials, what they say happened, brooke. >> joe johns will stand by. if you get anything from the secret service we'll get to you pass that along. miles o'brien is here, cnn aviation analyst. i'm going to ask you to pivot. as far as aviation in and around the white house, surveillance, how can they all add to this? >> i always think about 1994 when a cessna 150 flew right into the white house during the clinton years. and it was a suicide mission by a disturbed individual. since that time, there has been a steady increase in the perimeter around the white house. it was not too long ago that you could drive your car right down pens pen avenue right in front of the white house. those days are long gone. and there is talk now of
increasing the size of the fence. and of course we're talking about a complete no-fly zone over the city of washington, d.c. since 9/11. that was always prohibited air space anyway, but that's been extented and enforced in a more significant way. phil might be able to comment. i don't know if it's okay to comment about some of the defensive measures a rnd the white house that go after this kind of thing. >> i was just around the white house recently, and you see the snipers on the roof and in the vin. can you talk a little bit about that? >> there is a debate going on in washington about those defense measures. obviously we are talking about a national monument. the debate right now, should we extend the fences up. there have been fence jumpers. people get close, including inside the white house, an enbearsment for the secret service. but the number of people walking within that environment and going through white house tours is pretty high. i think the question is not going to be just how do we expand the perimeter, how do we ensure not only that the perimeter is secured but that we
prevent drones from flying over. that's also been a problem in the past year or two. what do we do about tourists going into that facility which was shut down after 9/11, and now in t now. >> we're going to fake a break. we have pictures up of the white house because there are reports of a possible shooting on or near white house ground. 17th and e streets or along west executive drive, a secure area. we are waiting to hear more from the secret service. the president is not on property. not on property. we'll be right back.
back with the breaking news here from the white house. as we've learned of the shots fired in or around the white house property. again, let me reiterate, the president is not on property. but this is what we just got. a suspect, who allegedly opened fire on the white house complex is down and is in custody. this is according to a law enforcement source. joe johns, you are there in the
briefing room. joe johns, do we know if this person was on white house grounds or firing into white house grounds? >> the report we have coming out from cnn's peter morris says a suspect who allegedly opened fire on the white house complex is down and in custody. according to a law enforcement official. so the question of course is whether that individual was him or herself on the white house complex grounds or outside the white house complex grounds shooting n. it's the kinds of situation that we have seen years and years ago when i worked for another network, someone outside the grounds shooting outside the white house. that's a possibility. but the more serious question is if there was actually someone inside the complex, inside that area on west executive drive where invitees and people with
passes are generally only allowed. so the question right now is level of security breach, what was this person doing? it seems quite clear that person is down, according to a law enforcement source reported by our peter morris. a lot of questions remain. nonetheless, it sound, from this report, that the situation is becoming secure. so that's about what we know right now. and not going to venture off into the area of speculation. brooke, we still don't know whether this individual was off the grounds shooting in or somehow inside the grounds shooting around. >> okay. joe, thank you so much. that was exactly the question you had, right? i mean, we just don't have -- we don't have the answer. >> that's right. if it's outside the grounds -- for those not familiar with washington, d.c., the amount of pedestrian traffic outside that facility is huge. >> huge. taking photos, walking by.
>> that's right. if somebody says a person with a weapon fired onto the compound from outside, i would not call that a security breach. it's not only tourists. there is restaurants. there is a lot of social activity around there. playhouses, ford theater is near there. let's wait until we see what we've got. a lot of activity. >> this is an officer describing the white house as condition red. does that mean anything to you? >> all it means is as soon as somebody hears there is an incident involving a weapon. if you are a security official you are not waiting, saying should i wait, some tiering of the security process. you are going to say i'm going to red right away and because i'm not going to take any chances during the time -- it might take 5 minutes or 2 minutes, during the time it takes me to figure it out. the boston police chief said i can't take a chance when we have bombers, i'm shutting the city down. people complained at the moment. but in retrospect was the right thing to do to take the
precautions. >> what does it mean when the condition red is called. whether or not an individual is on or the property, shots fired. what immediately happens on grounds. >> i haven't been there on condition red. but having been evacuated from the white house on 9/11, you have the security officials securing the compound. you have people preventing you from going out of the compound. this is a standard, to constitute down the complex and keep people on the perimeter. >> does it matter whether in fact the president is home. >> to my mind there is not much different. you have got the west wing, national security adviser, security officials involved with the national security official. his staff is there, regardless of whether or not he is there, including press people in the press office. >> do we still have joe johns?
do we still have joe, guys? that's a no. but we do have tom fuentes, former assistant director of the fbi with us here at cnn. tom fuentes, again, the news is that a suspect who allegedly opened fire on the white house complex is down and in custody according to a law enforcement source. how do you read this? >> that's great. i'm surprised they got that far. i heard phil mentioning it earlier that they would have gotten through the secure area to get on the white house grounds. so it's going to be very interesting to find out that somebody fence jumped from another side with a gun or how they actually gained access to the facility in the first place. we'll find that out i'm sure in the near future here. >> what are the other questions you have, tom? >> i think if the person is on the drowned there and they attack secret service that's going to be an fbi investigation to look into that, an attack on a federal officer is fbi primary jurisdiction. and it will be interesting to see what comes up in the next
few hours with the investigation with the response to this. in this particular case, fbi headquarters is only about six blocks away at ninth and pennsylvania. but the fbi field is at fourth, close to pennsylvania. they will have agents responding there to investigate the whole thing. >> let's talk about -- we don't even know precisely where this happened. according to joe, two different law enforcement agencies reporting two different areas. one being 17th and e streets, the other being west did theiex drive. that's a secure area. it has been a massive concern if somebody breached that area, had had a weapon and opened fire. as far as weapons rules on the property. can you talk about that. >> it depends who comes on the property. if you have an authorized law enforcement officer, they may have the weapons there and be authorized to have them. if you have somebody, whether
they are authorized or not. assault a secret service officer and take shots at a secret service officer it doesn't matter if they are on the grounds, across the street or down outside of town, if they attack a federal officer it is a federal violation. and it's the same thing. and you would have the officers have the ability to defend themselves and shoot back. >> if you are just joining us, we are following breaking news here at the white house. as not only reports of initial shots fired. we now can confirm that somebody is down. a suspect who allegedly was the one who opened fire on the white house complex, down and in custody. this is according to a law enforcement source. big key question that no one has an answer to, let's be totally transparent as to whether or not thatw this gun was on grounds or was firing from the other side of grounds. you know, if you've been to washington and you've been a tourist, you know you can get close to the white house. a lot of pedestrian traffic. a lot of people taking photos,
restaurants in the area. you can get press close. that's the question, right, whether or not somebody actually was on grounds or not when they alleged opened fire on this particular kind of weapon. phil mud is talking to me here, as a former cia counter-terrorism official, was in the dob on 9/11 and knows what it's like to have to evacuate. beyond the questions we have, the protocol we've walked through -- forgive me, i'm being told to go to joe johns. what do you know? >> a little bit more information. the situation is becoming clearer as we speak. the latest note from a law enforcement source says a suspect approached a secret service check point at 17th and e streets northwest here in washington presumably off the ground. the suspect brandished a weapon. service secret uniformed officers engaged the suspect. the suspect was shot in the abdomen and taken into custody. and it also says the white house has been downgraded to condition
orange. the vice president was secured in the white house complex during the incident. as you mentioned the president was not on the grounds. so more information from our peter morris. what that tells us, then, if that is true, is that the engagement of this individual with the gun occurred at 17th and e streets but not necessarily over on west executive. and that's the difference between a secure and non-secure area. we don't know the condition of the suspect. it is said that that person was taken into custody. still waiting to hear from the secret service on the record on this. but that's what we know, brooke. >> okay. joe, thank you. tom fuentes, i want you to translate that for me. that is law enforcement speak when you hear this official saying that the individual at the security checkpoint brandished a weapon. and then was then fired upon by
secret service. brandishing a weapon. what does that tell you? >> well brandishing usually means you have drawn a weapon and you are waving it around and possibly pointing it at them. and they don't need to wait around and ask you what you intend to do with that weapon. i'm sure they were shouting at the person to drop it and when the person hesitated or didn't drop it they went ahead and opened fire, which they are perfectly authorized to do. i've entered the white house grounds through that entrance there on many occasions on official business when i was in the fbi. the east si side of 17th street that location on e street is near the old executive building. and it is on an entryway that leads to the grounds. on the other side of the executive building is the white house. on the west side of that street -- it's a public street. that's a checkpoint area where the public can walk down the street. it didn't mean that person actually got on the white house grounds. but if they threatened and menaced and brannished a weapon, as they said -- weapons at a
secret service officer who is standing there manning that checkpoint, or a group of officers, then you have a federal crime, whether he set foot on the property or stayed on the west side of the street. >> oh, wow. >> doesn't matter where he was standing. if he threatened secret service officers that's a federal crime and they have a right to defend themselves. >> i bet you know that 17th street checkpoint. >> there is a second parallel piece of this that has to happen now. this individual might be down. we might be assuming this operation is over. i want to know a name, address, e-mail address, cell phone number, where did he come from? did somebody radicalize him? in this age of terror the question of what happened here can't stop just because the subject is down. now we have the secondary piece that says is there something else here that indicates that he plays a role in a broader conspiracy. but that's going to be no. most of the people in these situations are going to have
some sort of mental disorder but you can't assume that from the outset. >> as far as for people who aren't familiar with the white house and the 17th street security checkpoint can you tell me about it? >> sure. the white house compound on camera looks small. when you get up close. this is a large compound. not only the white house, but the grounds and the executive building next year, which looks ache a birthday cake, huge old 19th century building. around there you have tourises. this is only wrautd of iron fence. you can look right through to the white house. a lot of people are taking pictures. there are demonstrators across the street some of whom are camped out for months or years. the amount of activity around here is intense. and the likelihood where somebody could walk up to the secret service is -- you could walk up and say hello if you want. this subject suggest that anything went wrong. it might suggest that thing went right. >> as far as the response? >> that's correct, yeah. >> in your time at the white house we talked about multiple
instances of fence jumping. but somebody brandishing a weapon at the periphery of the white house, and whether or not he or she opened fire or not -- have you ever heard of that? >> i'm sure there have been instances. i haven't heard of this. i would say, without taking this too far, it's surprising we is so high, hundreds of thousands. maybe million as year. the fact that we hear so little of this in some ways is remarkable in american society today. >> thank you. we're looking at -- i'm listening to you and looking at these pictures trying to understand as much as we can which is not a heck of a lot. joe johns had that good reporting. the latest here as far as the white house is concerned, tom fuentes, do you have anything to add? >> i think when someone has been stopped by the secret service, either coming over a fence or trying to get through a checkpoint, even if they have a weapon, it's going to be difficult to shoot back at them
with all of the tourists in the background. it would be difficult to take a shot and risk other people's lives. it sounds like this individual was very threatening and close and the secret service officers were confident that they didn't have a large crowd to put at him if they opened fire. >> tom fuentes, thank you. a suspect approached a secret service checkpoint near the white house at state place and e street, according to a law enforcement source. the suspect brandished a weapon. we don't know if that means opened fire, waved this weapon, we don't know that yet. the sources familiar with the incident say the secret service shot a male suspect.
the suspect has been taken into custody. the president wasn't on the property. the vice president was. the suspect's condition is unknown let's go to evan perez for what he knows. evan? >> hey, brooke, that's what is happening right now at the moment. we are trying to figure out where this took place. it took place on the west side of the white house and as you might imagine, when something like this happens, the atf, secret service, park police all converge on this one location. in light of all of the recent incidents at the white house, there's been a lot more measures taken for anybody who approaches the gates or the complex, they keep an eye on them and keep them away from the fences, they've moved some of the fencing out to make sure people can't easily jump over the fence and try to get into the complex. a lot of increased security
measures have been taken and today you can see those measures coming into play we know the suspect was shot in the abdomen and has been taken to the hospital but we certainly don't know whether or not he was able to fire a shot. we know that the officers who wear white uniforms were responsible for bringing the suspect down, brooke. >> all right. evan perez, thank you. in washington, let's go back to the white house to joe johns with a little more information. >> what i can tell you is the emergency medical service, the people who transport individuals for one reason or another to and from the white house in ambulances has tweeted out that
they did pick up an individual who was suffering from a gunshot wound at 17th and e street. the information comes from a tweet from a d.c. government agency. to recap, what we are told is that this individual brandished a gun at 17th and e streets, was engaged, shot by secret service there on the scene. the situation was secured and the vice president was secured in the facility and now we're waiting for more information from the secret service about what they know. brooke, back to you. >> all right. joe johns, thank you very much. mr. mudd, you want to jump in? >> someone who has served there, it's not just pedestrian tourist activity. the number of political demonstrations in this area is very high. some of which are permanent in
the park across the street. i'm not a mental health specialist but i pass by there every day on my lunch break. the number of folks that have mental disorders is high. if you mix that with people pulling out cameras to take pictures, people demonstrating against the president and other causes, the pressure on the perimeter security guys when someone comes up with a weapon is very high. it's not surprising to say if somebody is brand dishing a weapon we're going to shoot them because there's so much pressure and activity around that area that they are going to be on a hair trigger. >> just because someone is mentally ill, to say -- >> when they approach you, it's quite evident that they have a few issues. >> miles o'brien, you've been sitting here risening to all of this. thoughts? >> what is worth remembering here, this is the people's house. it's a constant balance in our
democracy to maintain a sense of our freedom and access to this place. the fact that tourists still go through there is a security nightmare. the national security staff and members of the executive branch, it's a difficult balance. i hope we don't come to the day where we lose access to what we know as the people's house. >> uh-huh. it's a good point. it's pretty cool to be able to walk through the white house and yet threats such as these. evan perez, i want to ask you something about -- phil made this point earlier, questions about the periphery, the fencing around the white house and changes in the last couple of years. can you talk a little bit about that? >> brooke, it's -- as phil has
raised the point here this is an important phase in the american democracy and if you remember when they closed off that part of pennsylvania avenue which is very controversial some members want the street to be reopened as a way to show that this is a normal part of the american democratic system, the american capital but given the situations that we've had, the number of fence jumping incidents, that includes -- i was just there this past weekend. there's a lot more people who are both wearing uniforms and out of uniform walking around and keeping an eye on every single person that is there. you have a lot of tourists, especially on the south lawn there because there is a beautiful vista with the
washington and security personnel that have to be kept an eye on just recently, the secret service and homeland security department proposed raising the height of the fence as a way to discourage people from trying to get over the fence to try to get into the complex. it seems like when this happens it draws more attention to the place and draws more people who want to try to get famous by doing this type of thing. so now they are trying to figure out if they can raise the height of the fence and that has to go through the reviews that we have in washington. it's an historic building and has to be reviewed before you do something like that. at this point, though, we know that the system that they have in place seems to have worked. we don't know whether this man -- what his intent was,
whether he was trying to get over the fence but he was a threat and they decided to shoot him in the abdomen and he's down. the security environment we're living in, not only from these types of incidents that we keep seeing repeatedly at the white house but also the threat from terrorism that is ever present here in washington. brooke? >> evan, thank you so much. just in the 40 seconds tom fuentes that i have, i think miles o'brien's point is excellent. it's this notion that it's the people's house, we want the access. you can see right through to the beautiful white house if you're a tourist like the rest of us and offers true protection. >> the public tours at the white house, you get tickets to go on them and they happen in the morning. this particular entrance on the west side does not have a good view of the white house. the people going in and out of the white house are government employees like when i was in the government, going to meetings at
the white house or the executive office building. that's a business entrance this time of day in the afternoon. >> okay. tom fuentes, thank you so much. we're going to go to washington. jake tapper is picking up this special breaking coverage. over to you. welcome to "the lead." i'm jake tapper. a shooter apparently aiming a gun at the white house. law enforcement sources say an unidentified gunman brand dished a weapon at the secret service checkpoint on the white house grounds and they responded instantly firing on the suspect. we're told that they hit the suspect in the abdomen and stopped him, stopped him right where he stood and then they rushed to clear the north lawn, pennsylvania avenue, lafayette park and all of the areas immediately surrounding the white house.