covered. from the conventions to the general election. >> and thank you to detroit and the crowd here, thank you, again, for joining us. have a great evening. elite and the party cartel. john: donald trump is going toy build a big wall. hillary clinton will guarantee equal pay. bernie sanders offers all kinds of free stuff. young people like that. i'm surrounded by lots of young people. do you want the free stuff? >> no! john: what do you want? >> liberty *. we are at the students for liberty conference in washington, d.c. that's our show for tonight.
john: we are here with hundreds of college-age students from all over the world. they have gathered here at the students for liberty conference in washington to talk about immigration, dictators, death cults, public choice theory, campus rape, the open society and its enemies and more. this conference is titled the liberty vote. among the current presidential candidates, i wonder who is the liberty candidate? donald trump? >> no! john: hillary clinton? >> no! john were even the question is vague. americans can't agree what liberty means. to the occupy wall street movement liberty means taking present greedy banks and rich
people and giving it to people who are so poor they don't have access to the benefits of american liberty. alexis was an activist for occupy wall street. if you are very poor you don't have access to the good parts of america that rich people have. but patrice lee says so what if there is some inequality. government shouldn't try to force everything to be equal. we should tear more about liberty. >> that's right. a lot of americans feel angry because the system is rigged against them. when you look at corporate welfare, and you see how it's hard -- john: it could be rigged against you because you are black and you are a woman. >> we have come pretty far in this nation when it comes to equality for women and people of color. don't try to give me a lift up.
let me be free. it says i'm not good enough on my own merits and i'm pretty good, and so are a lot of the young people in this room right now. john: alexis? >> i think the system is rigged in favor of corporate interests against the individuals. donald trump is able to use the bankruptcy code to discharge debt that he owes his lenders four times in bankruptcy. but students who go broke are unable to discharge their student loans in bankruptcy. john: do you agree with bernie sanders who says it's unfair and we have to redistribute? >> a lot of the wealth is redistributed upwards. the top 20% of earners pay 80% of personal income tax in this country.
the flat tax is simple. eliminate ways corporations are able to cure special privileges and special benefit. and it make it easier for everyone to pay their taxes. >> wealthy people have more benefit from taxation and they should pay more taxes. reporter >> government take away opportunity for young people to get in there and provide competition to some of the established companies. my makeup and hair was done by a young entrepreneur woman. she had to spend 1,5. >> 0 hours getting licensed. we have too much government regulation. pluregulation. [applause] >> the lack of regulation lead
to cartels. john: lack of regulation. >> internet service providers, most people don't have a choice. you have to stick with comcast or verizon. john: these are local monopolies. hillary says there is unequal pay, men make more and women. women on achg maybe 77 cents. that sees to be fixed by government? >> the government has a role to play in disclosure. >> require every big company. report salary data based on race and gender. >> i worry about that. it's difficult for them to start collecting data on he single person based on ethnicity and to report it to the federal government who then will go after them and sue them. it will turn into a shame game.
they can't just sue arm theirly. >> if women make less that's proof there is discrip nation? >> there is discrimination across an income group. they are asking them to doubt it by the say job. wouldn't you encourage that? >> what about background or how much time they took off. maybe the women stayed home and had kid. aren't there differents? >> most of the time -- don't people value childbirth. >> childcare. women usually do more work than men because women do the childcare and cook and cleaning. john: and government shouldific that? >> government has the laws on the books. if you want to repeal them you can work through the congress to do that. john: people on the left say you are not really free if you don't make a living wage. do you agree?
>> maybe a living wage is important. john: what is a living wage? >> m.i.t. has a living wage calculator, $15 an hour is a good starting point if you have to pick a single number. john: should government pick any number? [no [. >> get government out of the way much trying to determine what the right wage is. government is not stopping a person from creating opportunity for themselves. john: what's wrong with setting a floor. >> when you are arbitrarily throwing out $15 an hour it sounds like this is a way to help poor people raise their familiar lition. nobody is raising a family on $7 an hour. it's just young people earning minimum wage. >> 75% of people making the
minimum wage are grown people, they are adults. they are raising families. john: why not $40. if the principle work that government can raise it, why not raise it more. it must hurt something at some point, right? >> you have need to be able to provide for your family. john: why not $100 an hour. >> i think the data bears out $15 an hour as a starting point so you can raise a family comfortably. >> is that $15 in washington, d.c. in san francisco or in alabama. john: here is your chance to ask questions of arecollectionis and patrice. these d of alexis and patrice. >> my question is with regards to regulating the free market and make it not so free. how is it we can regulate and legislate our economy in your opinion into prosperity?
>> government is setting rules to make sure people play fairly. when they don't set guidelines, wall street ran rampant, we had the 2008 financial crisis. they are trying to make sure the small upstart hedge funds don't break into the wall street cartel and without regulation that will continue. >> i'm taken upstart entrepreneur. when did it become a crime to be successful? [applause] what can i do? >> i think you can't break the law. with corporations are fine -- john: nobody even knows what the law is any more, there are so many. >> you don't think hsbc should be fined when they launder money to drug cartels.
john: it's just buying and selling. >> among all the free things bernie sanders wants to give us, he wants to give us free college. one thing my peers are look at is the rising cost of college. how can we we form the system? what can we do to make college more manageable. >> telling us we'll give you have free college is pandering. we need to say higher education is disruptive in many ways. >> we spend $8 billion a your giving pell grants and g.i. bill families who are failing left and right. you can redirect that into free public education. >> the k-12 system is failing. it would be an extension of that system. >> a private alternative to
public universities. john: profit is bad, publicly run is good. >> i would agree with that. yes. >> for every dollar of federal spending, colleges and universities increase their cost by 55 to 65 cents. they know they have washington shoveling dollars into them so they have to reason to compete and lower their costs. administrative costs are part of it. let's talk about what it means to be educated and productive in this economy. it doesn't necessarily mean a four-year degree which is what we have been told. i'm an individual. i don't want to be treated as a one-size fits all government policy. >> they are saying state schools
two and four years should be free and i think that's a good idea. john: thank you, alexis and patrice. i hope sufficient join this argument. use the mash #isflc16. you can find it. just more simply like my facebook page and post on my wall. bernie sanders has become popular with voters your age. what's wrong with people your age? that will be next. and i'll debate a libertarian who is inch smarter than me. but he says sanders is a good candidate for liberty. we'll find out why he says that when we come back.
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thousands of students have gathered to advocate liberty for free speech, the right to start a business and try new things. but this presidential campaign, one surprise is the success of an old democrat socialist candidate, bernie sanders who wants government to have more government and money. and he's getting big support from people your age. what's that about? emily eikins studdived the voters who say they feel the bern. what's wrong with these people? >> i think bernie sanders has captured their hearts and minds in ways other candidates like president obama and ronald reagan did in the past. they want inspiring candidates this they feel care a lot about him. after rand paul, we found that people who score high on go to
bernie sanders next. john: sanders economic planning would take power from individuals and give it to the sick. >> across a number of different polls we see young people are the most supportive of socialism and they are about as likely to say they like capitalism as socialism. john: are your friends dumb? >> part of it is young people don't know what the technical socialism is. and recent poll asked young people to use their own words to do it and only 16% of them were able to do it. for young people socialism means and naive yeah. that's something that needs to be corrected. scandinavia is not socialist. the prime minister of denmark went after bernie sanders and
said stop calling us socialist. sweden, denmark and scandinavia. john: got rid of labor laws. >> that accommodates their large social welfare state. that's what bernie sanders is talking about, their large social welfare state. john: how many of you have would consider voting for bernie sanders? >> no! john: no one here? >> government planning an industry or entire economy it tends to result in the same sets of consequences, long lines, rationing, lower quality care and less innovation. if you want less innovation then we can embrace those systems. but if you bant wants a cure or cancer and hiv, you have to have innovation and free markets even
in the healthcare system. john: polling found millennials start to turn against socialism the more money they make. >> if millennials started to make between $40,000 to $60,000 a year, their support for socialism decrease. they start working longer hours and start paying more in taxes. buy a house, have kids. they want to be rewarded for those efforts. that's what most americans think. >> on the popular netflix series "house of cards" the main character states to the public you are entitled to nothing. john: sounds right to me.
>> the root idea of socialism is everyone should be rewarded equally or at least according to their needs. regard lefers achievement and efforts. the yes of kids sports trophies. we asked should all kids who play on a sports team gets a trophy for participation or only the kids who win get a trophy. a majority said only the kids who win should get a trophy at the end of the day. but one group stood out who thoughts all kids should get a trophy and those were the 18-24-year-old college age americans. john: the socialists. next question. >> to i'm a representative in the south of brazil. a huge concern in brazil is many teachers in school indoctrinate in socialism and maxism in, --
marxism instead of education. this is the situation in the united states as well. >> people are not learning about what happened in the soviet union when they experimented with socialism. let's talk about history. what can we learn from those experiments? they didn't go well. john: your whole continent has experimented with socialism and it hasn't gone well and they keep doing it. >> they do, and we have to do something about it, that's why we are here, actually. john: thank you. emily ekin. next, should government be able to look into your smart phone?
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john: students for liberty. almost all of you have one of these things, a smart phone. how many of you actually worry that the government is going to watch what you do, spy on you? i mean, some people want to kill us. we all post things on facebook or snapchat are embarrassing that anybody can see. it's in the cloud. why is it worse if government is doing it? calia barns is with the electronic policy center. i'm thinking about this the wrong way? >> privacy is a fundamental right. john: so is life, people want to kill us. >> but when you are looking at massive government surveillance. private companies gobbling up
your information left and right. we have to fight more now than ever. john: i voluntarily give it to the university or facebook. >> you actually don't. as a student you are going to class and you say we are going to use this particular email forum. you didn't sign up to have your information data mined. you are not intending for an employer a take your private information and use tonight a way you didn't intend. john: if i want credit, i have to submit information. if the best information is data mining my phone, what's the harm? >> the harp is people can take information that shouldn't be included. whether you are expecting achild information that should not be collected. john: the government says in the caves our safety that it's going to save lives.
it's a best way to find a terrorist connect. not listening to my call, but this harmless data mining to see if i have a lot of patterns and they will get a warrant and get more. >> that's not what the fourth amendment requires. it's the right of the people to be secure in their papers, persons and effects against unreasonable government searches. the idea is the individual should be secure as opposed to government overreach. >> it's absolutely not reasonable. all of the call record they were gobbling. it's violating our 4th amendment. our fundamental right to privacy. john: they are clapping, but don't you think this might detect a terrorist attack before it happens? >> the information shows it's not the case at all. john: the san bernardino
terrorist's phone might reveal who they were conspiring with. apple says no we'll not find you a way in. should apple let them in? >> what apple i is saying is thy don't want to set the precedent to unlock the phones for millions of apple users in these situations. john: comments or questions? >> my county, the county sheriff partnered with the feds to bring in hailstorm devices that gather cell phone data in a drag met manner without a warrant. so this is -- john: for what? >> looking for terrorists supposedly but they won't provide the record. are there any other instances of the government weaponizing technology to invade your lives and invade your privacy out there? >> absolutely.
this is one of the examples of a fusion center where you have a federal government agency partnering up with local law enforcement looking for terrorist activities. but you see mission creep. you are catching petty crimes and drug dealing and prostitution. this would be a classic example of overreach. john: they would say they are catching criminals. >> we have a legal process. you can't go into a dragnet search of everybody in here. there is a little thing called a fourth amendment that required a warrant. >> what would you say the argument if you have nothing to fear, you have nothing to hide. >> we hear that a lot. than that fundamentally misunderstands how privacy work. the information belongs to you.
manage where you have a wife looking for divorce attorneys and that information pops up on the family computer. she doesn't have anything to hide. it's her right to look up certain information. and it's nobody else's business. and there may be other thing you are looking at. your information could make you an outsider based on political affiliations. i have done nothing wrong but that information can sometime be used against you. john: coming up, we get to argue with a donald trump supporter. that's next. pet moments are beautiful, unless you have allergies. then your eyes may see it differently. only flonase is approved to relieve both itchy, watery eyes and congestion. no other nasal allergy spray can say that.
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john: we are back at the student for liberty conference. the theme of the conference is the liberty vote. who should get that. how many of you think it should go to donald trump? michael john a tea party leader says he will vote for trump and thinks everybody should. welcome. you have got a tough one. >> that's okay. john: we don't think of trump as a liberty guy. >> that's part of the challenge of his candidates i. candidacy. he has to establish credibility with the liberty movement. >> you are a tea party guy. >> i am. a co-founder of the tea party movement.
so i'm very aware of some of the trepidation that might exist out there from the liberty and libertarian movement as it relates to trump. i think his positions are defensible. i don't think it's any secret to anyone that in global terror movements there is a great degree of commit to the penetrate this country. they intend to exploit the open border. >> this is a national security issue enumerated in our constitution. the employment situation in this country is abysmal, as bad as it's ever bern. we start by defending liberty by making america strong. he uses the phrase make america great again, you might consider it a cliche'. it's not a cliche'. america needs to be great in the
sense we are creating jobs. we are defending o respected around the world and restored ourselves to the principles that once guide the country. foreign workers are being brought in ostensibly because the skill ketz are not available in our labor force. in reality those that are learning are those skill sets do exist. these foreign visas are being issue offed to bring people in to train their replacements and drive wages down. john: but donald trump did that on his golf course. he had local applicants he said weren't any good. >> to look at this trump candidacy. this is a leap of faith. as it is with any candidacy you want to discuss here. every one i can sit here and rattle off areas that would give you have good reason not to
trust and have deep concerns. as it relates to trump he's not a professional politician. he has not spent his life watching every word he says. john: is he for single payer healthcare? >> you hear ted cruz say the all the time. but when i discussion expansion of medical savings accounts. when you discuss getting rid of the lines, getting rid of the inner-state restrictions that exist on the purchase of health insurance. you are talking about strengthening a private sector, not a public sector healthcare system. john: we'll have so much winning you will get sick of wing. you have questions for michael. they are eager to talk to you. >> how can you as a tea party member say you support freedom if you don't support freedom in borders and how can you support
candidates who want endless war. >> i think you could make the argument that trump more than any other candidate has been a critic of our engagement in iraq, clearly has raised major reservations about nation building. he's the only gop candidate who said openly and forthrightly that our even ghaijt iraq was a mistake. he said that proactively. john: he has been more proactive about going to war than rubio or cruz or kasich. >> are we in the business of building a world aligned with our ideological principles at the convenient defend our country or are we in the business of defending a country and having a country. >> it's my understanding the tea party came about as a rebellion of big government. but donald trump is an
authoritarian across the board and supports big government across the board. >> let's take a look at it. if if you have had a chance to review his tax policy. big cuts. including -- he's a clear ally of our position that we share collectively against common core and education. he's forthright in saying the federal government overreceived that. he's a champion of school choice. i acknowledge this government has gone the too big, out of control, filled with waste. >> coming up. if this audience won't support trump, who will you vote for? we'll find out. also i'll debate that
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john: this is the students for liberty conference. the liberty vote. when it's time for me to vote for president wp, i don't know who i will pick. my preferred candidate dropped out, senator vanlds paul. why didn't he do better? i don't know. but jerry taylor says he knows. he's president of the think tank and he used to be with the cato center. he says libertarians ought to be less pure. >> not quite. they need to be a little more realristic. about 5% of americans think the way we do. my candidate was ron paul, too. he didn't make it. he had his teeth kicked in by authoritarians taking this country in a direction i have
never seen in my lifetime. my points is for 35 years we organized libertarians ideas and we haven't gotten very far. we are going to keep coming back to -- to meetings like this. one of the reasons people have a hard time with libertarians is when rand paul says if i was a senator in 1964, i would have voted against the civil rights act. most americans will not embrace a candidate candidate who said tough people should suffer under the teeth of libber i. john: rand paul said in your private business you get to temperature on serve people if they stands on their heads. >> 5% say yes and 95% say no. john: what else could rand paul say that would have changed
people's minds. >> milton freedman and hyatt support a welfare net to support the indigent and the poor. john: it's grown from a safety net to a giant hammock. >> 65% of entitlement spending don't go to poor people. immigrants are scapegoated for economic problems. and trade is scape quoted. we find ourselves moving in the opposite direction. john: we shouldn't support open free trade? >> we are not going to get open free trade if people think in the economy they operate in. if there is not a safety nept, they are not going to embrace the economy. john: there is a safety net, it's just not there. >> not very robust. food stamps.
we hear about that. you know what the average house hold receipt is for food stamps a day? it's about $2 a day. if we had to choose between a robust social welfare safety net and free market economy, or less of a safety net, less protection for the poor and more regulated, less free economy, which one would you choose? john: your plan for victory is to surrender. >> i don't think it's surrender when you have tell people if you are not blessed moving into this economy with a skill set that will allow to you contribute, tough. i don't think that's surrender. john: you say we should be more sympathetic to sanders. >> there is more to liberty. john: economics really matters. >> it matters, but so does ...
>> i think one of the reasons the founding taught terse created this country to be federal is states can compete among each other with the welfare systems. some will have it and others will not have it. that's why many people are moving from the people's republic of california to the free state of arizona. >> you want competition in government and there is no principle objection to that. but when we talk about the poor and indigent. our narrative cannot be taxation is theft, taking from "a" to give to "b" is a gross violation of all that's right and holy and if you can't contribute beg for your supper or dive through a dumpster. we can't say that without finding ourselves in we are, 5% of the american public and no
presence in washington. >> bernie sanders wants social security and all of it. how is that not a legitimate complaint when he wants to expand the welfare for the middle class as well as the poor. >> i think libertarians have an opportunity to say if we are going to take from some to give to the others, let the others be poor people who need it. there is a place for libertarians to fill the vote in american politics. >> what's the point of having a free economy where we can become wealthier when 60-70% of our wealth is taken away from us. >> let's seriously even gang. what if it is the case that since most people in america are not hard wired like us and we know that perfectly well. we know on college campuses libertarians are not typical
amongst your classmates. if we know people are not going to embase a hotly competitive economy without trade barriers and labor barriers and let the economy rip, and they won't embrace that unless there is a guarantee that if they can't contribute productively they will fall through the cracks. yawn * thank you, jerry taylor. you get to vote for a president. who will they pick? at ally bank, no branches equals great rates. it's a fact. kind of like bill splitting equals nitpicking. but i only had a salad. it was a buffalo chicken salad. salad. put under a microscope, we can see all the bacteria that still exists. polident's unique micro clean formula works in just 3 minutes,
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more proactive selling. what do you think michal? i agree. let's get out there. let's meet these people. yawn * most of us are not happy with our choices this elect season. on the left we have big government democrats who want to increase regulation and taxes and give government more power over our lives. on the right we have big government republicans who want to spend more on the military and police people's bed rooms. who will libertarians vote for? there will be a libertarian candidate. the stossel show plans to hold a forum for the four leading candidates. gary johnson, austin peterson, and software entrepreneur john
mcafee. we can decide who we think would be the best president. all of them would be better than the current frontrunners hillary and donald. but third party candidate haven't done well in american presidential elects. as a thought experiment, let me ask you, if you have to vote for one of the current democratic or republican candidates, who would you vote for? wouldn't vote? you have to vote. i'll list the candidates in the order of how they are doing on election betting odd. that's the best prediction market that gives the best forecasts of what happened in elections. the frontrunner right now is hillary. will anyone here vote for hillary? yes, we have got one. anybody vote for trump.
bernie sanders? marco rubio? okay, ted cruz? we got some cruz and rubio. how many say no one because they are all awful? they are all status. the good news is that we are a government of checks and balances. so there is a limit to what bad things these politicians can do to us. maybe our semi free market will allow american entrepreneurs to grow the economy more than poll figures can crush us. do you think it might happen? let's hope for it. that's our show from student for liberty. we'll be back in new york next week.
trump. >> have a great week, everybody. thank you. good evening, and welcome to the fabulous fox theatre in downtown detroit. i'm megyn kelly, along with my co-moderators bret baier and chris wallace. >> 59 republican delegates are at stake here in the state of michigan during next tuesday's republican primary, the biggest prize out of four states holding contests that day. for tonight's debate, we're partnering with facebook. the conversation about this election has been intense. as the crowd is here.