tv The Last Word With Lawrence O Donnell MSNBC December 7, 2016 10:00pm-11:01pm PST
i know nobody else is focusing on it. but they are keeping this prospect alive. and it is astonishing. and that does it for us tonight. we will see you again tomorrow. now it's time for "the last word with lawrence o'donnell" with lawrence o'donnell. good evening, lawrence. >> oh, rachel, sorry. i was on here trying to buy a share of exxon on e-trade. >> yeah. >> but i don't have e-trade on here. and i don't know how to buy a share of exxon. >> well, yeah. if the secretary of state's still got them when he gets sworn in, i can't tell you what's going happen to those shares. >> only in trump world. thank you, rachel. so donald trump, the champion of american workers is now tonight attacking american workers. he is blaming the workers at the carrier plant in indiana for carrier's decision to move their jobs to mexico. and tonight donald trump attacked those workers' union leader chuck jones. chuck jones will be our first guest.
>> person of the year is a tremendous honor. >> well, the decision is not made as an honor. >> the person of the year is the one who has hathe most influence over events of the year for better or worse. >> divided states of america. i didn't divide them. they're divided now. >> i'm counting on president-elect trump to tamp down on this bitterness. >> can we agree, president-elect trump, that at this stage it would be better for you to simply stop watching "snl"? >> i like alec. but his imitation of me is really mean-spirit and not very good. >> he is a very forgiving, very magnanimous kind of a guy. >> is he a bona fide republican? >> we're just different people circumstances he a republican? >> you see through tweets he can affect industry. he affected the stock market and he did it twice. >> when he is tweeting about boeing and good companies, he is actually trying the say who is in charge right now. >> i think i am very restrained. >> you are looking and acting as if you are mean and petty,
thin-skinned and vindictive. stop this. >> donald trump, who last week presented himself as the hero of the workers at a carrier plant in indiana is now attacking those very same workers, and blaming them for carrier moving their jobs to mexico. donald trump has congratulated himself repeatedly for saving over a thousand jobs at carrier from moving to mexico. he praised carrier for not moving those jobs to mexico, even though carrier told donald trump they still intend to move 1300 jobs at least to mexico. so in that trump deal, more jobs would be sent to mexico than kept in indiana. yesterday chuck jones, the president of the united steel workers local that represents the carrier workers said that donald trump, quote, lied his ass off about the number of jobs
saved. here is donald trump lying his ass off. >> united technologies and carrier stepped it up. and now they're keeping actually the number is over 1100 people, which is so great. >> chuck jones says that carrier has informed them that the actual number of jobs that will remain is 730 jobs. chuck jones made that point on cnn earlier tonight. and minutes after he said it, donald trump tweeted this. chuck jones, who is president of the united steelworkers 1999 has done a terrible job representing workers. no wonder companies flee country. >> joining us now is chuck jones, president of the united steelworkers local 1999 union. chuck jones, what is your reaction to donald trump's tweet about your comments tonight? >> you know, coming from a man that has fought real hard to try
to keep people from organizing unions in his hotels and casinos, i guess i would take it as a thank you or indicative of we must be doing a pretty good job representing our people to provide them with good wages and good benefits. so, you know, short of that, you know, i don't put a lot of credence what he said. the only thing i was trying to do was correct him on some of the misstatements he made. and what he said was save 1100 jobs. that was a falsehood. and a lot of our people, when president-elect trump said that earlier in the week before we knew what the exact numbers was last week had got their hopes up that they were going to keep a job, when in all reality, and we found out last thursday at noon that there was going to be 730 jobs remaining.
another 70 supervisory clerical. but he was wanting to count in the 350 research and development jobs that the company when they made the announcement in february were staying here in the city anyway. so our people got false hopes because the company wouldn't come out with the numbers of who was staying, who was going. so a lot of our people that thought they had lost their job thought they was going to have a job. in all reality, like i said, 730 staying. and here in indianapolis 550 are losing their livelihood. >> another tweet he tweeted a little bit later tonight was directed towards you. he said if united steelworkers 1999 was any good. that would have kept those jobs in indiana. spend more time working, less time talking, reduce dues. now there he is in that tweet, very clearly blaming you, blaming the workers, the
unionized workers for carrier sending these jobs to mexico. now when he was campaigning for president, he blamed carrier completely. he never said that he blamed the union. he never said that he blamed the workers. if he had said in indiana that he blamed the workers at carrier for those jobs being sent to mexico, would he have gotten support and votes from workers at carrier and members of your union? >> i'm going assume that some of them would have thought twice before they would have voted for mr. trump. and probably wouldn't have vote for it. the whole thing is ridiculous. he takes exception to being corrected. and on my numbers i'm correct and he is wrong. on the promises that he made to the campaign circuit to the american people about carrier, he is saying he didn't say. so he is wrong on that. he stood up last thursday and
told falsehoods. and that's what i was calling him out on. now i appreciate him very much for getting involved and saving 800 jobs that is going to remain here, countless the salary people. without his input, that probably wouldn't have got done. so i appreciate it, and i made it perfectly clear on every interview i've done that i appreciate that. now he wants to turn around. he wants to slam me. so, you know, i'm not bothered by it by no means. and i'm not backing up on my position. he is wrong and i'm right and we'll move on. and if he wants to keep on tweeting, i'll keep on responding. >> well, and he is not just blaming you. he is blaming the workers and all the unionized workers there. >> yes. >> he is saying if those workers, if the united steelworkers were any good, they would have kept those jobs in indiana. now the way you would have kept those jobs in indiana would be to cut the wages. >> yes.
>> when donald trump was trying to keep those jobs in indiana, did he ever call up the steelworkers union and say please cut your wages. please give back money to the company. stop taking such high wages from this company so that your jobs can stay there. or did he just negotiate with the company and didn't negotiate with the workers at all? >> he just negotiated th the company. and in fact, what we did when we sit down with the company, when the announcement was made to try to save the jobs, $23 million a year in concessions was offered up to the company. that was -- they costed everything. said $23 million. they said you can't come close to the $65 million they were saving. so it was a nice effort. but you can't do it. now in order to achieve the $65 million, all your people would have to work for $5 an hour, which is below minimum wage,
which is against the law, and they would have no benefits, no insurance, no health care, no nothing. so we're moving to monterrey, mexico. it doesn't the fact that we didn't spent a lot of time and effort to see what we could do to save this place. i don't know if he realizes or i really don't care if he does or not. but that's the truth of the matter. >> there is donald trump tonight, blaming the workers because you wouldn't take $5 an hour, which you couldn't, even if somebody decided they wanted to since it would be below minimum wage. there had been some news reports tonight that since you went public on this, you have received threats from trump supporters. what can you tell us than? >> better keep an eye on your kids. we know what type of car you drive, things along those lines. but i've been doing this job for 30 years. you know, i've heard inch from people wanting to burn my house
down, shoot me, and everything else. so, you know, i they can with a grain of salt, you know. i don't put a lot of faith in that. and i'm not concerned about it. i'm not getting anybody involved, the authorities. nothing i can deal with. people that, you know, make stupid statements and i'll move on. >> i just want to go back to that moment when donald trump is out at the plant in indiana at carrier. we think of all the things he said. we all watched what he had to say out there. and i'm just wondering, if somewhere in the middle of everything he had to say, he had said if the united steelworkers was any good. that would have kept those jobs in indiana. if he had said that, would he have gotten applause from that audience he was speaking to? >> i don't think as much, you know. and, you know, to go back to his statements, when he was given
those statements, the people sitting in that room did not know. because we had just seen some hours before from that company what the breakdown of who was keeping their jobs. he got up there and said numerous times that we have kept over 1100 jobs here at carrier. well, i would think the average person in the room that didn't know the breakdown thought that they was talking about manufacturing jobs. they was talk about their jobs. and they didn't mention, well, we are moving 550 jobs to monterrey, mexico. now also here in indiana, we're losing -- and it's not one of our units. it's iew. 700 utc jobs. now the taxpayers of indiana anted up $7 million over ten years. i'm not the best maybe math major by no means. but company was saving $65
million a year by moving all the jobs except the r&d people to monterrey, mexico. they've got $5 billion with a b in military contracts. nobody is going to maybe admit to it. if i were mr. trump, i would have felt i had some pretty good leverage on utc. but they created that i talked to the company and they recreated and the state of indiana offered up $7 million over ten years. that's a drop in the bucket. but it's still taxpayers' money here in the state of indiana that went to a very profitable company. and we're hearing a lot of feedback on that. >> chuck jones, thank you very much for joining us tonight. i really appreciate it. >> lawrence, thank you very much for having me. >> thank you. >> we're joined now by david corn, washington bureau chief for mother jones, msnbc political analyst, and annemarie cox, political correspondent for mtv news. and annemarie, these tweets tonight, i'm just imagining
donald trump saying these very same things when he was in the factory with those workers at carrier, it's all your fault, workers. that's why these jobs are being moved to mexico. >> well, you know, i'm really stuck on something that chuck said about what he did say in that room, which is that he lied to the workers' faces. he did more than insult to them. he gave them the impression that their jobs were being saved, and they weren't. there are people who thought in that moment, applauded for trump in that moment because they thought he had saved their jobs. and he didn't. and that is, you know, a monstrous lie. i, you know -- this comes a little bit too late, right? there are those of us who knew he was a liar before this. i feel -- i wonder about what those workers feel today. i wonder if they're the first round of people that we're going to see regretting their votes for trump. i do think that this is something that i know we've
talked about, which is that that middle class and lower middle class white voters that voted for trump, they are going to be some of the people hurt the most by his policies. i mean, there are a lot of vulnerable groups that are going to be hurt. but these people, these are some of the people that are going to be hurt the most when he finally gets in office. he managed to hurt them before he got into office too. lied about that. >> david corn, donald trump ran as we'd never seen a republican run before as the champion of the working american. and he is going to save the jobs. and against all the trade policies that republicans have been in favor of. and it only took -- it only took a fact correction by chuck jones. it only took one fact correction by a union leader for donald trump to become pure republican. and now jobs moving to mexico are entirely the fault of the
workers themselves. can you imagine what would have happened tonight if alec baldwin had tweeted out that donald trump had lied about the carrier deal? i mean, i don't know if we could go on after that. i don't know if donald trump could go on after that. i loved it when chuck jones said, you know, if he keeps on tweeting, i'll keep on responding. now that's the modern day union spirit, you know. fight, fight, fight. organize, organize, organize. here you have a guy, donald trump, who lives literally in a gold plated apartment now blaming the people that he claimed to be a champion of while pushing through corporate socialism, which republicans always said they were against. carrier is getting $7 million in these tax credits from indiana while it's already saving $65 million or it will be less now moving these jobs overseas. it's been used a lot of that money, those savings to automate its factories here in the united states.
and i'm betting ten years down the road when it's still getting those tax credits, those jobs, even if they stay here will no longer exist. so this is really not about helping workers in the long run. it's not about having a coherent economic policy that will help anyone else other than these workers. and on top of it, donald trump is lying. it's like a trifecta of trumpianism. >> we're joined now by phone by leo gerard. he is the international president of the united steelworkers union. he is also vice president of the afl-cio. and leo gerard, i'm going to read for you these two donald trump tweets. because i know you've been traveling and you grabbed a soon for us as soon as you could. he tweeted tonight after chuck jones made some public comments about the correct number of jobs that were being kept at carrier. he said chuck jones who is president of the united steelworkers 1999 has done a terrible job representing workers. no wonder companies flee the
country. and then his second tweet was if united steelworkers 1999 was any good, they would have kept those jobs in indiana. spend more time working, less time talking. reduce duce. dues. there he is saying look at what these workers are doing. no wonder companies flee the country. that's a complete blaming of the worker for this situation. >> well, thanks, lawrence, for getting me a chance to at least be on the phone. i guess my first response is really one of sadness. now i'll say more. but we've got someone who is just about to become the president of the united states. most important job on the planet. and he is busy tweeting about a local union president who is in fact a hero. chuck jones is someone who is standing up, fighting for his members, refused to accept that carrier was just going to get to walk away.
he and his membership in our district director made this a national issue. every time a politician wanted to talk about the economy, chuck jones and his local talked about what about carrier moving to mexico for $6 an hour and telling us to our face in a warehouse nothing personal, we're going because we can make more money. and chuck and his people stood up to that. and now because we have a president who clarified the facts, the president of the united states decided that he should call them names. i'm terribly disappointed, and i'm also angry. look, the fact of the matter is that our union offered carrier, what would it take to keep you here. and they said there is nothing you can do that would keep us here unless you want to work for under $5.an hour. but chuck wouldn't accept that, and his members wouldn't accept that, and they kept making an issue of it.
i want to say we wrote a letter to the president-elect not long after the election telling him that we were prepared to work with him to repeal and replace nafta, to repeal and replace pnpr, to negotiate a fair trade standard, to help him with infrastructure, to help him grow jobs and raise wages. we haven't had a response to that letter yet. so i'm really one of the people that think chuck jones is a hero. he stood up for his members. and for the president-elect to get so upset because chuck was simply tear fight. let me say this. i know from my dialogue with our membership and with chuck's local in particular, that when people heard that 1100 jobs were going to be saved, they were enthusiastic that that could be their job, only to find out later that the fact wasn't 1100 jobs, it was 730. so they went on a high thinking they have a future. then they got slammed back down.
and it was in chuck's class, a man with tremendous class in his membership said hang on, i'm going to clarify it. and hi went to get additional information and found it was only 730 jobs. so i think cck jones is a hero and one who has fought for his members very well. >> it seems that donald trump has a lot to learn about the way unions work. especially in this second tweet. and it's always -- it's always interesting to take apart donald trump's words, because frequently they have no meaning, or they're completely filled or filled with ignorance. and in this tweet where he says if the union was any good. that would have kept those jobs in indiana. clearly blaming the union and the workers. and then he tells the workers and the union to do this. he said spend more time working. he wants people to spend more time working at this plant. apparently he thinks they're not working, not working enough. and then he says reduce dues. now explain to donald trump what
dues, union dues have to do with whether carrier keeps jobs in indiana. >> they have nothing to do with whether carrier keeps jobs in indiana. in fact, our union dues are a little over not quite 1.5%. so they're minimal to carrier's operation and to the work we do. and again, i want to go back to what carrier said at the time when they made the initial announcement. they said that it had nothing to do with the quality of their work. and this was a high quality, efficient, well run facility. what it had to do with is they were going to mexico because they could do it for $6 an hour. there is no worker in america who could work for $6 an hour. it's in fact lower than the minimum wage. even if you didn't do it in pesos, but you did it in dollars. so to make that comment is really an insult to the workers who are making a quality product. one of the things that amazed me for a long time about this was that the president-elect and
others on the republican party were talking about carrier air conditioners. in that factory, they don't make air conditioners. they make furnaces. and mexicans don't need furnaces. what those furnaces were going to do, they were going to be made in mexico and shipped back to america. so the president hopefully will stand by his word and say that any company who is going to export work to another company and then try to import them back to this country after firing workers is going to get nailed with a 35% tariff. i support the president doing that. so will our union. >> well, he seems to have changed his theory what is going on with these jobs. now that he is blaming the workers for the jobs being sent to mexico and blaming the union for the jobs being moved to mexico, why wouldn't we expect in the future when there is an announcement of jobs being moved to mexico, why wouldn't we then expect donald trump to then
negotiate with the workers and try to get the workers to cut their pay down to whatever it has to be cut to in order to compete with the mexican worker? >> let me tell you. the majority of places that our jobs are being exported to, and we've been fighting -- the steelworkers union has been fighting this business of outsourcing jobs to other developing countries for more than 35 years. we've been on this because we knew what the agenda was, and we knew where it would take us. we've lost more than six million jobs. here is the thing. we could not work low enough in wages and benefits to maintain jobs against mexican worker, chinese worker, bangladeshi workers, and the fact of the matter is if we were doing this, we would be betraying our membership. we need to sit down and have a fair trade policy. and like we said, we're prepared to work with this president to repeal nafta, to repeal pnpr, repeal the deal with south korea and negotiate a fair trade deal.
we're ready to work with him. >> leo gerard, thank you very much for joining us tonight. i really appreciate you joining us on this breaking news. >> thank you very much. >> thank you. david corn, ana marie cox back with us. david, i'm really struck by this turn by donald trump. this is back to the classic republican position of the loss of these jobs is the fault of the worker, the fault of the union for demanding too high a wage. and you need to both break the union and reduce wages in order to hold on to these kinds of jobs. and that just puts donald trump squarely where the rest of the republican party has been on this for a very long time. >> well, i'm not surprised by anything donald trump does anymore. i don't think there is a core set of principles. i don't think there is even a paragraph of principles or policy guidance that he adheres to. it's whatever works for the moment.
and we do know, though, that one way to get his attention is to criticize him. and he was lashing out. a union guy criticizes him. so he automatically goes to the republican anti-union playbook to strike back. i mean, it's childish. it's certainly not presidential. and it's actually quite dangerous. so any time a company or a union leader or a citizen, maybe ana marie cox does something that trump doesn't like, he'll be tweeting and trying to affect your life in a negative way. i mean, kellyanne conway was bragging that he got the stock from bowing to go down after boeing criticized his trade policy. this is a step towards authoritarianism. i don't like to be hyperbolic or mongering any fear. but this is really not the way the president of all america should behave. >> tonight donald trump tweeting "no wonder the companies flee the country because of what
workers demand to be paid." he said if the union had done its job, they would have kept those jobs in indiana. and ana, it just makes me wonder, the next time this comes up and donald trump tries to make a phone call to a company that is thinking about moving jobs to mexico, that company just says back to donald trump here is the phone number for the union representing our workers. call them. get them to cut their labor costs, cut their wages, and then we might be able to keep those jobs. there is no reason for the company not to use donald trump's labor logic and labor cost logic against donald trums argument. >> because trump himself has used that logic for his own businesses. trump's own businesses are no friend to labor. you want to know what his core set of principles are? look at the way he runs his businesses.
he does not like using union labor himself. so why would he ever think that other businesses should use it too? and you're very right. he doesn't seem to understand the point of a union. the point of a union is not just to keep jobs, right. it's not jobs over anything else. it is to have jobs that are worth keeping. it is to have jobs that pay a decent wage, that come with the kind of benefits that we have in the modern era. that come with the kind of benefits that people can have a life as well as a job. and i'm also struck by the way in this exchange tonight, who was behaving more presidential? was it donald trump or chuck jones? i actually have my money on chuck jones. i think the one that would act with dignity today. >> it is the guy that already has the title of president, chuck jones. ana marie cox, david corn of mother jones, thank you for joining us tonight. >> thank you. coming up, kellyanne conway warned businesses he might just tweet about them if they have anything to say about him. he might drive down their stock
price because he now has the power to do that. rick wilson and felix salmon will join us. kellyanne conway is now th . but i keep it growing by making every dollar count. that's why i have the spark cash card from capital one. with it, i earn unlimited 2% cash back on all of my purchasing. and that unlimited 2% cash back from spark means thousands of dollars each year going back into my business... which adds fuel to my bottom line. what's in your wallet? because it knew an ordinary wastissue was near.ar. the fiery ssue left her no sore and red. so dad slayed the problem with puffs plus lotion, instead. puffs have pillowy softness for dakota's tender nose. with lotion to comfort and soothe when she blows.
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generosity is its oyou can handle being a mom for half an hour. i'm in all the way. is that understood? i don't know what she's up to, but it's not good. can't the world be my noodles and butter? get your mind out of the gutter. mornings are for coffee and contemplation. that was a really profound observation. you got a mean case of the detox blues. don't start a war you know you're going to lose. finally you can now find all of netflix in the same place as all your other entertainment. on xfinity x1. kellyanne conway is now bragging, actually bragging about donald trump's ability to help or hurt business was his tweets in public comments. she is especially proud of his attempts yesterday to help a japanese company and to harm a
very important american company. because, you know, that's what the president of the united states is supposed to do. help japan and hurt america. >> president-elect trump sees that he has this massive online platform. through tweets now, he can affect industry. he affected the stock market yesterday, frankly. and he did it twice. he did it in two different ways. first by telling boeing to cancel the project or maybe put it on hold. he thinks it's too expensive and it goes against his entire plform of cutting waste and abuse this the sysm. and then their stocks went down wasn't.5% yesterday. and secondly he went down to the lobby in trump tower where the media are and announced a $50 billion, that's with a b investment by softbank. and their stocks went up. >> and another entry in the file of stupidest things kellyanne conway has ever said. joining us now felix salmon, senior editor at fusion, and rick wilson, republican strategist who is a contributor
to the daily beast. rick, this is a new one. you attack american company, try to drive their stock price down because of course you're president of the united states. and you do everything you can to help those japanese companies in any way you can. >> you know, yesterday was another example of donald trump trying to engage what i call gangster capitalism by going out and rage tweeting about boeing. of course it wasn't true. of course it was completely made up out of trump's bizarre mental landscape. but the fact of the matter is this is a guy, and now kellyanne is out bragging about it, who really wants to wage economic warfare against our own companies, our own folks. bowing is the kind of company that is a $96 billion a year company. they export billions of dollar a year of products overseas. they employ tens of thousands of people at high wages. donald trump decides he wants to attack them because he read an article where the ceo expressed minor reservations about donald trump's insane trade war policy. this is a guy who is out of
control. and this gangster capitalism, soprano-style governance is not going to work over the long haul. >> let's listen to what he said to matt lauer today about his threat to boeing. >> you went on the say this, "i think boeing is doing a little bit of a number." now i read that as you saying you think boeing is perhaps taking advantage of the american taxpayer. do you have any proof of that? >> well, i think their planes are too expensive. i spoke to a very good man yesterday, the head of boeing, a terrific guy. and we're going to work it out. but, you know, that's what i'm here for. i'm going to negotiate prices. and the planes are too expensive. and we're going to get the prices down. and if we don't get the prices down, we're not going to order them. we're going to stay with what we have. >> felix, the planes are too expensive there is no price for the planes. they don't exist. there is no price. it hasn't determined what the price could possibly be. he says if we don't work out a
lower price, we're going stay with what we have. what that means is after he is president, the president of the united states will be flying around in 35-year-old air force one, which is already 25 years old. and they are having trouble keeping it maintained because boeing is not keeping the parts supply flowing for those old planes. you can gone and on about how crazy this particular thing is. but here is somebody who is now very proud, and kellyanne conway very proud that they managed to drive down temporarily the stock price of boeing. >> because what rick just said is absolutely right. this is gangster capitalism. i like to think of this as russia style capitalism. where what he really meant is how close you are to the president and how much of a friend he is to you. and donald trump has friends all over the world. and if his friend is in japan, that's great. if he reads something bad about boeing, or more to the point if the head of boeing says anything rude about him, then he'll they
can out on that company. he will do diplomacy by tweet. it's a chaos monkey in the white house. and this cannot end well. >> let's listen to paul ryan explaining that there will be no donald trump 35% tariffs on anything. >> what if -- >> speaker ryan, i want a bill on my desk putting a 35% tariff on some of these goods coming back. in what would you tell him? >> i'll tell him what i've been saying all along. we can get it through a comprehensive tax. >> through a carrot, not a stick? through a carrot. >> joe kernan got it right. you're not going to do it. that's what paul ryan's answer is going to be when the 35% tariff comes along. >> the house and the senate right now are going out of their way to accommodate donald trump's lunacy, and donald trump's intemperate nature. but there will come a point
where adults in the room say we're not going to give this child what he wants, especially if it's a 35% tariff which would be like a nuclear weapon going on in the wallets of middle class americans. it would raise the prices of consumer gods a radical way. it would crash out our econo. a trade war is a doomed artifact of the trump promise, the architecture of the trump promises. but it's one that paul ryan and those guys, they recognize what actually happens if you go to engage in a trade war with asia. it's like a land war in asia. it never works out well. >> and felix, tonight donald trump is blaming the workers for these jobs moving to mexico. and so this theory that he had, i'm going to put a 35% tariff on those companies that move to mexico, that -- the whole theory of that tariff is out the window now that he is blaming the workers. >> well, he is blaming the unions. this is him trying to carry out his republican base who love anyone bashing unions.
and let's be honest about this. he is not going to even want 35% tariffs. the 35% tariff is something he talked about on the campaign trail, and has not talkeabout once since he became elected. so he is not a friend of the worker. he is not a friend of the unions. he is not a friend of labor. he is a friend of a certain group of rich capitalists that will suck up to him. >> we're going have to leave it there. rick wilson, richard salmon, thank you for being with us. one of the most comprehensive aborges laws. it is consumer?
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happen. i'm willing to -- i'm pro-life. the judges will be pro-life. but having to do with abortion, if it were overturned, it would go back to the states. so it would go back to the states. >> but then some women won't be able to get an abortion. >> no, it will go back to is the states. >> they'll perhaps have to go to another state. >> the republican-controlled state legislature in ohio just passed the strictest abortion law in the nation that would ban abortions once a fetal heart beat can be detected, which would be as early as six weeks into a pregnancy, before many women even know they are pregnant. the ohio senate president said this when asked why move on that bill now. >> new president, new supreme court justice appointees change the dynamic. and that there was a consensus in our caucus. >> do you think this will survive a constitutional challenge now?
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shut your mouth and say goodnight mouthbreathers. breathe right. one of the things i went through, you're still solid on supreme court justices. >> originalists. >> yeah. one to appoint very soon. we're going to have to come up with a name. i'm looking. i'm down to probably three or four. >> are these from your list? >> from the list. they are terrific people. highly respected. brilliant people. and we'll be announcing that pretty soon too. >> the supreme court might have to rule on ohio's new law in cases banning abortion in cases where a fetal heart beat can be detected. joining us now sarah sleiman, reproductive rights in texas. sarah received national attention in 2013 when she was removed from the texas legislature while advocating for abortion rights. she appeared on "the last word" at that time to talk about this issue. sarah, the fetal heart beat can be detected as essentially as six weeks. many women do not know they're
pregnant at six weeks. this bill is clearly in violation of roe versus wade. and so in the current regimen, it would seem that federal appeals court would knock this out. >> i, lawrence. yeah, it appears that all of the rights that we found in the constitution, whether it's privacy or the right to not provide an undue burden, all those constitutional protections should be upheld. and i want to deliver a direct message to governor john kasich right now. sir, mary fallon of oklahoma has done the hard work for you. she refused to sign in a very similar bill to law this year that would criminalize and penalize abortion doctors with a felony. sir, you have the power to veto this law. and send it back and make these people work on issues that affect ohio working families. please don't do this. please just veto this law. >> and john kasich is -- calls
himself a pro-life republican. but he has not issued an opinion yet as to whether he would sign or veto this, which is in itself possibly surprising. >> well, the way hb-493 came into being, this bill, this child abuse bill, the sponsor of this bill did something really sneaky. just like in texas where they snuck it into special session, they never want to have the debates about reproductive health care and abortion health care in front of people. they want to sneak it in. what they did is tacked on this heart beat work on to a child abuse prevention bill when the stipulations in the abortion part don't even have exemptions for people who have been raped or abused. it's a mockery of that legislative branch and how bills should be brought to the floor. i understand that the senate democrats there in ohio have already brought challenges, and it didn't meet the appropriate process. but going become to wh you said earlier, it's just scientifically a joke of a bill. most women don't know they're pregnant until nine or ten weeks in.
it's just another opportunity for certain right wingers in the state of ohio to beat up on pregnant people instead of working for ohio's family and getting to real solutions, like the suburbs that plunged into poverty this year. they had the greatest increase in poverty around columbus suburbs this year. what are people ignoring when they're writing these still sylvesterly unscientific and unconstitutional bills? john kasich, do not sign this bill. send it back and make these legislators work. >> as john kasich knows, roe versus wade protects the abortion up to 24 weeks. this would cut it down to six. so it's clearly in violation of roe versus wade. for kasich to sign it is to sign a bill into process where in the current regime it would never take effect. >> in the current regime, it would not take effect. like i said, there is already a precedent. governor fallon in oklahoma saw this coming from a mile away. i don't know how she felt about that bill, but she was willing to put an toned the madness.
>> sarah slammen, thanks very much for joining us. i really appreciate it. >> thanks, lawrence. >> we'll be right back. verly d's costarred as the daughter. chris columbus was the director... it's called claymation... narwhals really exist... actually guys, it was the ghost of christmas past... never stick your tongue on a frozen flag pole... yukon cornelius... "die hard" is considered a christmas movie! that's the unlimited effect. stream your entertainment with unlimited data when you switch to at&t and have directv.
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so a guy who hates my politics did a very kind thing last week. last week phil tweeted this. lawrence, i hate your politics. a lot. but i saw your closing last night and just donated $55 to kind. good work. thanks and merry christmas. the segment phil saw was about the kind fund, kids in need of desks in african schools that don't have any desks. and phil's $55 will provide one desk that will be made in malawi by factory workers in malawi, and delivered to a school in malawi, where at least two, maybe three kids will slide on to that bench for that desk. and for the first time in their lives, they will not be sitting on the floor in their classroom. this is what the typical classroom in malawi looks like, kids sitting on the floor in the classroom all day, trying to write by holding the paper on their legs, or sometimes holding
the paper on a friend's back. it's an impossibly difficult academic environment for students and too muchers. when you ask teachers in malawi what they need, the most common thing is chairs. they just want chairs to get the children off the floor. the kind fund is a unique partnership of msnbc and unicef. and it provides desks for kids in need of desks. kind. during thanksgiving week, i went to malawi on another desk delivery trip. and on my first day in malawi, something very important to the kind fund happened back here in the united states. in new jersey where the kind fund was presented a check for $4,030 all raised by students in the school district. mary jo paul man got the money to raise money for kind. and when she showed the students the videos of my reports on the kind fund, the kids wanted to help.
so they raised money in a walk athong. here is mary jo paulman presenting that check with some of the students on the monday before thanksgiving. their contribution will provide more than three classrooms of desks. hundreds of students will use those desk. classrooms in malawi are about the physical size of our classrooms, but they're terribly overcrowd. some have more than 100 students. most classrooms have about 90 students. three classrooms of desks will lift close to 300 students off the floor. two days after the kids in metuchen delivered that check, we delivered 300 desks to a school in malawi where the kids had never seen desks and never expected to see desk. we'll show you the transformation of that school on another night. bill tweeted, lawrence, if a guy who hates your politics could donate a desk, so can i, and i love your politics. i am just so glad that every
year people who can disagree on politics can agree on a cause like kids in need of desks. heather tweeted last night i donated $10 to the kind fund. that's really appreciated because any amount is helpful. ryan tweeted saw the kind piece with my year-old daughter addison. she asked to give a desk instead of receiving hanukkah gift. done. anna tweeted i just made the world better for kids. and anna is exactly right. that's exactly what these contributions do. and they make the world better for the kids of the factory workers in malawi who have the jobs making these desks. these are workers who would be unemployed without your contributions to the kind fund. their children never have to worry about where their next meal is coming from as long as their mom or dad is employed in one of our three desk factories in malawi. praise continues to pour in for 14-year-old joyce on twitter.
she is the girl in her second year of high school who recited her poem for us on the show last week. she's one of the girls the kind fund supports with a scholarship to get her through high school. when you make a donation to the kind fund, you can specify whether you want it to go to desks or scholarships for girls. thanks for opportunity to give, pay it forward. jean wingate tweeted, joyce's powerful poem touched my heart. i donated a desk and scholarship. the poem little by little and the smile on the faces of those beautiful children brought tears to my eye. you can contribute and give a desk or scholarship and they
will send an e-mail notifying them of your gift. on the same day the kids in new jersey were donating. one handed me this note. it was folded like this. i opened it to find a thank you note. i'll read you this thank you note on another night. i just wish that each of you could hold one of these notes in your hands, because every one of you have made the kind fund possible. this girl in this high school thanks every one of you and every one of you deserves one of these notes. but the best i can do is to simply say thank you. msnbc's live coverage continues
into "the 11th hour with brian williams." that's next. tonight, getting personal again. the president-elect on the attack once again, using twitter to go after a single individual. this time it's a union official who publicly criticized the carrier deal. >> also tonight, new reporting on what donald trump plans to do with his business and the trouble he may find himself in on day one of his presidency. we will preview a big story in the morning papers here tonight. and just what kind of advice is trump getting from the current president? what he said on that matter today as the world's most exclusive fraternity prepares to add a new member. "the 11th hour" begins now. good evening once again from our headquarters here in new york. donald trump taking to twitter to attack an individual american, in this case the local union leader who questioned the number of jobs trump has saved